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schnarre
Commander
Joined: 08 Oct 2007
Posts: 333
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 Posted: Wed Dec 08, 2010 2:07 am Post subject: |
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The Prequels are not canon, and my version of the clone wars has the Old Republic (cobbled together from the info provided from WEG, and various pre-Phantom Menace [in order of creation] sources), is nearly overrun by an army of clones (not quite worked out who is in charge, or why the war happened [not a priority at the moment]).
...It had been my understanding--especially after reading the Thrawn Trilogy--that it had been the opponents of the Republic using clones, especially since the Imperial Sourcebook makes clear that the Republic had no grand army, but numerous units from various parts of it. I've toyed with the idea of running in such a setting (& have something to wit), but nothing has come of it as yet.
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Kemper Boyd
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Joined: 28 Jun 2008
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ZzaphodD
Rear Admiral
Joined: 28 Nov 2009
Posts: 2426
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| Posted: Mon Jan 03, 2011 11:05 am Post subject: |
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| schnarre wrote: | The Prequels are not canon, and my version of the clone wars has the Old Republic (cobbled together from the info provided from WEG, and various pre-Phantom Menace [in order of creation] sources), is nearly overrun by an army of clones (not quite worked out who is in charge, or why the war happened [not a priority at the moment]).
...It had been my understanding--especially after reading the Thrawn Trilogy--that it had been the opponents of the Republic using clones, especially since the Imperial Sourcebook makes clear that the Republic had no grand army, but numerous units from various parts of it. I've toyed with the idea of running in such a setting (& have something to wit), but nothing has come of it as yet. |
Can you spell 'Retconned'? 
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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010
Posts: 16281
Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
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| Posted: Mon Jan 03, 2011 9:31 pm Post subject: |
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| schnarre wrote: | | ...It had been my understanding--especially after reading the Thrawn Trilogy--that it had been the opponents of the Republic using clones, especially since the Imperial Sourcebook makes clear that the Republic had no grand army, but numerous units from various parts of it. I've toyed with the idea of running in such a setting (& have something to wit), but nothing has come of it as yet. |
Unfortunately, canonically speaking, the SW movies overrule the various official materials found in the Imperial Sourcebook. As for the Thrawn Trilogy, we still have a huge gap of material in between E3 and E4. Who knows what kinds of atrocities or political manipulations were committed by the Empire during that intervening period to turn the opinion of the general populace against the clones. After all, a single incident of sufficient magnitude can be enough to shift public opinion literally overnight (and if you don't believe me, ask one of your Muslim friends what its like to fly on a commercial airliner since 9/11). |
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Kemper Boyd
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Joined: 28 Jun 2008
Posts: 68
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| Posted: Mon Jan 03, 2011 10:43 pm Post subject: |
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| crmcneill wrote: | | [Unfortunately, canonically speaking, the SW movies overrule the various official materials found in the Imperial Sourcebook. As for the Thrawn Trilogy, we still have a huge gap of material in between E3 and E4. Who knows what kinds of atrocities or political manipulations were committed by the Empire during that intervening period to turn the opinion of the general populace against the clones. After all, a single incident of sufficient magnitude can be enough to shift public opinion literally overnight (and if you don't believe me, ask one of your Muslim friends what its like to fly on a commercial airliner since 9/11). |
I'd say that there is no canon involved when you talk about something which is per definition derivative, such as role playing games. Lucas won't show up at your house and stop you from running the game however you want. |
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GMgreatness
Lieutenant Commander
Joined: 12 Mar 2010
Posts: 101
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| Posted: Tue Jan 04, 2011 12:04 am Post subject: |
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The Original trilogy is always going to be my favorite, with the 10 years or so post ROTJ being a close second. As far as my SW Universe history goes, I am fine with just about everything that has come out from Tales of the Jedi, through Legacy. I do dislike the whole concept of the Vong, but I accept that it happened.
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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010
Posts: 16281
Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
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| Posted: Tue Jan 04, 2011 12:21 am Post subject: |
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| Kemper Boyd wrote: | | I'd say that there is no canon involved when you talk about something which is per definition derivative, such as role playing games. Lucas won't show up at your house and stop you from running the game however you want. |
My understanding is that the hierarchy of Star Wars canon includes the movies, the movie novelizations, and the radio broadcasts, in that order. Specifically, anything in the radio scripts was considered canon, so long as it didn't contradict anything in the movies or novels, and the contents of the novels was considered canon so long as it didn't contradict the films. The films were at the top of the pyramid, so to speak, and any and all content of the films was incontrovertible (although interpretation of the events was something that defies an easy explanation).
Apart from those three, everything else is considered official material, or apocryphal (I know Lucas puts the Holiday Special in this category). That means that it exists, and is considered part of the SWU so long as it doesn't contradict the Holy Trinity of the Canon. That also means that any background material on the formation of the Empire (specifically in the Imperial Sourcebook, but also in others) is over-ruled if it contradicts the canon. |
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dhawk
Lieutenant Commander
Joined: 27 Sep 2009
Posts: 191
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| Posted: Tue Jan 04, 2011 2:29 am Post subject: |
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Not a big fan of the prequels, especially since much of the material contradicted what the Thrawn Trilogy attempted to explain about the Clone Wars. I envisioned a Republic Army and Navy, supplemented by Jedi Knights and detachments of Freedom's Sons, battling against vast armies of cloned soldiers, of whom were assisted by the Mandalorian Warriors, which layed waste to countless worlds in the galaxy.
So much for that, huh?
It doesn't really matter to me what's canon or not; I tend to enjoy much of what the EU has to offer, in the form of the earlier novels under Bantam Spectra (namely the Thrawn Triology, the Rogue Squadron books, the Corellian Crisis, the Black Fleet Crisis, etc.). I still enjoy the Legacy comics, which is fresh, and although very dark, still has that Star Wars feel, and even some of the classic elements from the OT.
Roleplaying-wise, I would play or GM in the universe established by our online PbP club (Star Wars Roleplaying Club). One of the campaigns I ran is evolving into a sourcebook that I've been working on (the Karlien Sector Campaign) that is linked to the canon New Republic era (after Black Fleet but before the New Jedi Order).
In short, Star Wars is what you make of it, and what each person wants it to be. Whatever the Flanneled One decides (for good or bad) doesn't influence me that much, unless of course, it damages the one project I'm assisting on. |
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Kemper Boyd
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Joined: 28 Jun 2008
Posts: 68
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| Posted: Tue Jan 04, 2011 2:42 am Post subject: |
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| crmcneill wrote: | | My understanding is that the hierarchy of Star Wars canon includes the movies, the movie novelizations, and the radio broadcasts, in that order. Specifically, anything in the radio scripts was considered canon, so long as it didn't contradict anything in the movies or novels, and the contents of the novels was considered canon so long as it didn't contradict the films. The films were at the top of the pyramid, so to speak, and any and all content of the films was incontrovertible (although interpretation of the events was something that defies an easy explanation). |
I mentioned earlier in this thread the concept of death of the author, which I think is easily applied to Star Wars universe. The core of it would be that whatever Lucas says or Lucasarts says is just an opinion with no more weight than any other, their interpretation is not more valid than anyone elses.
Considering the movies actually contradict one another, I think picking and choosing what you want to include in your games is more than valid. |
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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010
Posts: 16281
Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
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| Posted: Tue Jan 04, 2011 3:18 am Post subject: |
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| Kemper Boyd wrote: | | Considering the movies actually contradict one another, I think picking and choosing what you want to include in your games is more than valid. |
I recall the conflict between the end of E3 an Leia remembering her mother in E6. Are there other contradictions that I missed? |
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Kemper Boyd
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Joined: 28 Jun 2008
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| Posted: Tue Jan 04, 2011 4:27 am Post subject: |
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| crmcneill wrote: | | I recall the conflict between the end of E3 an Leia remembering her mother in E6. Are there other contradictions that I missed? |
Offhand, Uncle Owen does not remember owning C3PO twenty years before, and Obi-Wan doesn't seem to be aware of the fact that Luke and Leia are brother and sister. |
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garhkal
Sovereign Protector
Joined: 17 Jul 2005
Posts: 14168
Location: Reynoldsburg, Columbus, Ohio.
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| Posted: Tue Jan 04, 2011 4:39 am Post subject: |
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Owen didn't own C3p0 though at the end of Ep3.
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Azai
Lieutenant Commander
Joined: 05 Jul 2010
Posts: 248
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| Posted: Tue Jan 04, 2011 12:27 pm Post subject: |
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I believe in Ep2 Attack of the Clones C3PO is owned by the lars household, because Anakin left it in his mothers care.
It shows R2 and 3PO meeting and 3PO leaving when Anakin goes to rescue Obi-won, after burying his mother. . |
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jmanski
Arbiter-General (Moderator)
Joined: 06 Mar 2005
Posts: 2065
Location: Kansas
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| Posted: Tue Jan 04, 2011 7:36 pm Post subject: |
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I'd hardly classify that as a mistake. How could he remember one droid from 20+ years ago, especially when you see droids everywhere?
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Grimace
Captain
Joined: 11 Oct 2004
Posts: 729
Location: Montana; Big Sky Country
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| Posted: Tue Jan 04, 2011 9:03 pm Post subject: |
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C'mon people. Nitpicking what is or is not a contradiction between movies, or what is or is not "canon" is just silly when talking about the topic of this thread: What is the Star Wars universe to you.
I, personally, don't follow "canon" at all and roll my eyes at people who try to espouse to others how important it is to accept what is "canon". We understand that some people like to accept everything that is told to them by Lucas no matter what he says. But it's also good to remember that not everyone abides by "canon" and therefore trying to dictate what we should and should not accept isn't going to sway any opinions.
If I just want the original three movies to be my Star Wars universe for my games, then that's my choice and Lucas can go scream at a wall for all I care.
I'm also in the camp that the ENEMY for the Clone Wars should have been the clones. They way it is now, it would have made more sense to call them the Droid Wars, or the Seperatist Wars. So in my Star Wars universe, the clones were the enemy and there was no "Grand Army" formed until Palpatine takes power and institutes martial law. |
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