dodge and surprise...

[garhkal]

Just got done doing some game talk with a former gamer (no longer plays, but he still likes to talk about it).

Ok, we know of an ambusher manages to stay hidden before he makes his attack, it is a 'surprise attack', and the defender gets no dodge. But what if they are already in combat??

EG.
Bad guys 1-5 are fighting the pcs, while bad guy 6 and 7 are still in 'sneak' mode moving behind them (they were not even seen before hand).
Round 1 goes as normal for pcs versus BG1-5. Round 2 the same. Perceptions to see BG6 & 7 still no joy.
Round 3, they are finally in position and launch their attack, STILL no joy from the pcs to detect.
Would their dodges they make to avoid the firing from BG1-5, count for BG6 and 7? OR cause it is a surprise attack, their dodges against BG1-5 do NOT count???
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Confucious sayeth, don't wash cat while drunk!

[Gry Sarth]

My ruling is that a dodge made in response to fire from BG1-5 would not count against BG6-7. However, a Full Dodge would.
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"He's Gry Sarth, of course he has the stats for them."

[Chabit Rane]

I think I would have to agree with Gry on this too.

[Boomer]

I agree as well. Regular reaction or penalized dodge, does not count against the surprise attackers behind.

Full dodge, just never mind any other action and leaping out of the way, surprise or not that is tough to hit.
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My backpack has jets!
I'm Boba the Fett!
And I bounty hunt for Jabba Hutt,
to finance my 'vette!

[bitrate]

something i was talking with a friend about, but haven't got the books in front of me to reference: how would this figure in with a jedi's danger sense?

[garhkal]

Define?
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Confucious sayeth, don't wash cat while drunk!

[Delkarnu]

If a Jedi Has Danger Sense up, the sneak attack people would have to declare any attacks against the Jedi, so he could react , the other players could not.

[DarthMortis]

[Delkarnu]

[DarthMortis]

[garhkal]

which at most might allow another perception check to them.
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Confucious sayeth, don't wash cat while drunk!

[DarthMortis]

I suppose
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"I believe the Jedi are weak so they give up their emotions. I believe the Sith are weak so they give up to their emotions. I lay somewhere in the middle, not afraid to keep my emotions, but afraid to lose myself in them." - Daroth Mortanis

[Delkarnu]

Danger Sense only warns the Jedi of an impending attack on them, doesn't affect the order of attack. If the Jedi has a danger sense warning of a surprise, I'd give them a perception roll for initiative. If they act first, they can call out a warning (no more than a "get down" or so) and people could dive for cover. If the attackers win the initiative, they would be able to act before the Jedi could give a warning and only the Jedi could dodge.

In the already in combat example, I wouldn't tell the Jedi it was a surprise attack, only what type of attack and direction. In a hallway, an attack from behind should tell them its a surprise, but in the open, if they are fighting enemies from multiple directions, they may not figure out it is new enemies.

Danger Sense AND Combat Sense, the Jedi could act first, attacking the new threat, and the others could get a perception check to see if they realize a new enemy has arrived and get to react based on that check.

I think this is one where no 'rule' can cover the result, its all based on the specific situation and how the GM at the time wants to handle the situation

[jmanski]