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| How to force imperial troops to surrender? |
| Command |
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5% |
[ 1 ] |
| Con |
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20% |
[ 4 ] |
| Intimidate |
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30% |
[ 6 ] |
| Persuation |
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20% |
[ 4 ] |
| Blaster |
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25% |
[ 5 ] |
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| Total Votes : 20 |
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Jedi Skyler
Moff
Joined: 07 Sep 2005
Posts: 8440
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 Posted: Mon Sep 26, 2005 12:15 pm Post subject: |
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| Gry Sarth wrote: | That was much better put scott, and you also have a very convincing argument with the issue of Luke's height.
I just think it's a whole lot more interesting to have stormies as recruits instead of clones, it opens up a lot more options. |
That's right, it does. It adds a human element to the stormies, which allows more opportunities to the PCs.
| Quote: | Poke me if I'm wrong, but I am pretty sure Boba Fett was a clone. Just an unaltered clone with no growth hormones.
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You are correct. They said it in the movie; that was Jango's price for being the template: a single, unaltered clone for himself. |
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KageRyu
Commodore
Joined: 06 Jul 2005
Posts: 1391
Location: Lost in the cracks
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| Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2005 2:28 am Post subject: Re: How to force imperial troops to surrender? |
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| adnielsen wrote: | Hi
We played last evening, and at some point my players managed to sneak up on and suprise a small group of Imperial army troopers.
It was sort af a standoff, where both the players and the troopers were equal in power, but the players had the edge due to their surprise appearence.
Not wanting to risk the potential fatalities associated with a gunfight, one of the players opted for forcing the troopers into surrendering.
At the time I decided that con or command as the appropriate skill to use for this.
After the game, we had a little debate on whether con/command was the correct skill to use in the situation and whether persuation or intimidation could/should be used instead.
What skill would you as a gamemaster use in this situation? |
Based on the situation you describe I would say that any of the following skills could work: Con, Bargain, Persuasion, Intimidate.
A character using Con, would be basically fast talking the imperials into surrender, and probably highly exagerating the advantage the PCs actually have. A character using Bargain, on the other hand, would simply point it out matter of factly...i.e., "we have the edge, the only purpose served by continued fighting is more bloodshed on both sides. If you surrender, we promise humane treatment of prisoners, and we will tend to the wounded." While a character using Persuasion may use some of the elements of bargaining, he would also try to make it seem like it is in the Imperials best interest to surrender for other reasons, and basically sweet talk them into it. A character using intimidate on the other hand would basically point out that "we have the firepower, and either you surrender, or we're gonna use it." It all comes down to what approach the PCs wish to use, and what style they have. You could also apply situational modifiers based on the style chosen and the nature of the battle. I would find command inapropriate as it is used more for issueing orders, and would be less useful against troops that are openly hostile.
_________________
"There's a set way to gain new Force Points and it represents a very nice system, where you're rewarded for heroism, not for being a poor conductor to electricity." ~Jachra |
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KageRyu
Commodore
Joined: 06 Jul 2005
Posts: 1391
Location: Lost in the cracks
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| Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2005 2:43 am Post subject: |
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| Gry Sarth wrote: | I agree that where the movies and EU conflict, you should go with the movies. But I feel that in this issue, in the words of Vader: "There is no conflict." The movies never allude to the fact that Stormtroopers are clones, while the EU strongly reinforces the idea that they are just indocrinated people.
Just because someone is totally loyal, it doesn't mean they're clones, it just means that the Empire has a very good indocrination and propaganda system.
The info on the official site suggests Stormies aren't clones. And just because Ep3 Clonetroopers look more similar to Stormtroopers it surely doesn't mean stormies must be clones.
But I understand this is not a perfectly clear issue, so if you want stormies to be clones in your campaign, it is really easy to accept that as the truth. These gray areas is where we are each allowed to make up what is our very own Star Wars Universe. |
There was a thread about this exact topic in the Characters forum, regarding Stormtrooper PCs. There is official information supporting both points of view I feel, and I believe the stormtroopers are a mix of clones and indoctrined troops to keep the illusion. As far as the whole issue on the spartii chambers, the emperors ban on clones, and the hows, whys, whos, and whats...they were already covered at length in the other thread. Don't forget, Lucas alludes to the fact Stormtroopers are clones many times, and Lucasfilms Technical Journal supports it too. I personally feel both sides are half right.
_________________
"There's a set way to gain new Force Points and it represents a very nice system, where you're rewarded for heroism, not for being a poor conductor to electricity." ~Jachra |
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TarlSS
Sub-Lieutenant
Joined: 19 Aug 2005
Posts: 60
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| Posted: Tue Dec 06, 2005 9:04 am Post subject: |
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In the Empire comic books and Battlefront II, it's revealed that the Empire's Stormtroopers are a combination of clones AND recruits.
At the end of the Clone Wars, Kamino rebelled and generated another Clone Army to fight for the Jedi. The Emperor destroyed them and outlawed cloning because it posed too much of a threat to his base of power. He stopped using clone troops because since he now controlled the civilian population base, it was easier and cheaper to recruit and indoctrinate then commission clones. The normal clones since they shared the same psychological profile, had familial bonding and other loyalty issues. When one person defected in the group, the entire group would.
The old clones were kept however, because they were veterans and well trained. After they got old, they were not replaced. (Perhaps because the secret to creating a large and psychologically stable Clone Army, accelerated growth programs and training regime had been lost with the Kaminoans) In Empire and many Star Wars comic books there is a subtext for the conflict between recruited and cloned Stormtroopers.
Stormtroopers are soldiers of course, they surrender when surprised and outnumbered. Although they are brainwashed, I don't believe they're fanatical death troops of nigh-impending doom. In ROTJ they surrender, and in ESB they surrender when being surrounded by Lando's men. If there's a perceived chance at victory or extraction they will likely fight, but I think they would surrender as soon as any highly trained troop would- not often, but yes.
Thrawn used clones because it was faster and he was desperate for men, lacking the resources of the old Empire. Again, the Spaarti techniques had defects and he needed Cboath to control them
Since George Lucas actually reads comic books and the explanation makes a great deal of sense, I think the explanation is canon. |
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Jedi Skyler
Moff
Joined: 07 Sep 2005
Posts: 8440
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| Posted: Tue Dec 06, 2005 9:39 am Post subject: |
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| KageRyu wrote: | | Gry Sarth wrote: | I agree that where the movies and EU conflict, you should go with the movies. But I feel that in this issue, in the words of Vader: "There is no conflict." The movies never allude to the fact that Stormtroopers are clones, while the EU strongly reinforces the idea that they are just indocrinated people.
Just because someone is totally loyal, it doesn't mean they're clones, it just means that the Empire has a very good indocrination and propaganda system.
The info on the official site suggests Stormies aren't clones. And just because Ep3 Clonetroopers look more similar to Stormtroopers it surely doesn't mean stormies must be clones.
But I understand this is not a perfectly clear issue, so if you want stormies to be clones in your campaign, it is really easy to accept that as the truth. These gray areas is where we are each allowed to make up what is our very own Star Wars Universe. |
There was a thread about this exact topic in the Characters forum, regarding Stormtrooper PCs. There is official information supporting both points of view I feel, and I believe the stormtroopers are a mix of clones and indoctrined troops to keep the illusion. As far as the whole issue on the spartii chambers, the emperors ban on clones, and the hows, whys, whos, and whats...they were already covered at length in the other thread. Don't forget, Lucas alludes to the fact Stormtroopers are clones many times, and Lucasfilms Technical Journal supports it too. I personally feel both sides are half right. |
I've been agreeing a lot with Kage lately on his take on some of the issues posted in several threads. This one is no exception. It would make no sense for the Empire to just up and do away with all the clone troopers. I agree that they wouldn't be replaced, because it would be MUCH cheaper (and quicker) to forcibly conscript and re-educate new troopers. Plus, the Emperor could be even more in control of what the newbies were being force-fed than he could if he had an outside agency such as the Kaminoans growing clones for him. |
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