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Whill
Dark Lord of the Jedi (Owner/Admin)
Joined: 14 Apr 2008
Posts: 10402
Location: Columbus, Ohio, USA, Earth, The Solar System, The Milky Way Galaxy
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 Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2022 9:59 pm Post subject: |
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I'm caught up again. I am really into this show. I love all the "boring" details, like the discussions of political ideologies ("Separatists" are still a thing in the Imperial Senate). I appreciate the canonization of all the Legends stuff, and seeing all these worldbuilding details in live action for the first time. It's great. And eight episodes in, there still aren't any contradictions to the Lucas films, RO, or Solo. So far, Andor is the best Star Wars TV series show ever.
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TauntaunScout
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Joined: 20 Apr 2015
Posts: 981
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| Posted: Wed Nov 02, 2022 6:51 pm Post subject: |
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| Whill wrote: | | I'm caught up again. I am really into this show. I love all the "boring" details, like the discussions of political ideologies ("Separatists" are still a thing in the Imperial Senate). I appreciate the canonization of all the Legends stuff, and seeing all these worldbuilding details in live action for the first time. It's great. And eight episodes in, there still aren't any contradictions to the Lucas films, RO, or Solo. So far, Andor is the best Star Wars TV series show ever. |
For people like us it is.
For kids, it's The Mandalorian. Two years running I've gone to Halloween at my kids school. There's a LOT of costumes for that show on display. Kids really love it.
I'm really glad to finally see Star Wars without The Force. Also, to have a series that will hopefully shutup the stupid trolls who insist that the empire was good. It was funny in CLERKS but it hasn't been funny over the last few decades of internet devil's advocates. We get to see the empire being evil a lot in this one.
One thing I don't like in newer Star Wars stuff, is using flashbacks for things. It's confusing as heck to younger viewers. And this is a kids' franchise. |
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Darklighter79
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Joined: 27 May 2018
Posts: 529
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| Posted: Sat Nov 05, 2022 11:35 am Post subject: |
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In the last SWd20 there is a chapter about styles of play. One of them is immersive storytelling with an example of political turmoil in Senate. No focus on combat but on talking, developing in-depth personas, and character interaction. Basically whole sessions may pass without a single blaster being fired.
Now we have a ready tutorial for this: all the scenes with Mon Mothma (Senate, her house) and her interaction with Luthen. Perfect.
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Whill
Dark Lord of the Jedi (Owner/Admin)
Joined: 14 Apr 2008
Posts: 10402
Location: Columbus, Ohio, USA, Earth, The Solar System, The Milky Way Galaxy
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| Posted: Sat Nov 05, 2022 10:20 pm Post subject: |
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I'm caught up again. So they didn't follow the 3-episode pattern this time. Instead of building up to a climactic action sequence, they just raised the stakes even higher and built further. Maybe the last half of this season is a 6-episode arc and it is going to be a really big finish. Still the best Star Wars series so far.
One thing I don't really understand is, why did Andor take his money and go to a planet with an oppressive Imperial presence and Rebel activity. If he really needed to lie low, he could go be a "tourist" on plenty of planets with no Imperial presence. I get the literary point that his false arrest from just being in the wrong place at the wrong time and sentenced to slave labor is meant to justify his rising hatred for the Empire, but there really should be many places to avoid the Empire. Maybe he eventually wanted to set up a fencing operation again so couldn't go too far into the wilderness of the galaxy? It would have helped if they had established why he went the planet he got arrested on in the first place.
| TauntaunScout wrote: | | Whill wrote: | | I am really into this show. I love all the "boring" details, like the discussions of political ideologies ("Separatists" are still a thing in the Imperial Senate). I appreciate the canonization of all the Legends stuff, and seeing all these worldbuilding details in live action for the first time. It's great. And eight episodes in, there still aren't any contradictions to the Lucas films, RO, or Solo. So far, Andor is the best Star Wars TV series show ever. |
For people like us it is.
For kids, it's The Mandalorian... Kids really love it... One thing I don't like in newer Star Wars stuff, is using flashbacks for things. It's confusing as heck to younger viewers. And this is a kids' franchise. |
Kids were always intended to be included, but saying Star Wars is a "kids' franchise" is misleading, because Star Wars is for everyone (including kids). Most of us here are not kids. My dad was in his 30s when he took my brother and I to see ANH in the theater, and he still says that ever since then, it has been one of his favorite movies of all time–he didn't even grow up with SW like we did.
And you seem to indicate that the newer franchise using flashbacks makes it not kid friendly, so by your criteria wouldn't that make it not a kids' franchise? And kids really love TM which is newer SW stuff, and it uses flashbacks.
| TauntaunScout wrote: | | I'm really glad to finally see Star Wars without The Force. |
Although the stories we've seen so far mostly focus on Force-users, it is a giant galaxy with a very small percentage of Force users, so it should be quite easy to conceive and produce stories without them. I don't expect Force users so I don't even think about their absence in Andor when watching it. I've ran entire campaigns with no Force users ever appearing.
| TauntaunScout wrote: | | Also, to have a series that will hopefully shutup the stupid trolls who insist that the empire was good. It was funny in CLERKS but it hasn't been funny over the last few decades of internet devil's advocates. We get to see the empire being evil a lot in this one. |
Actually, I feel that the films more overtly show the Empire being evil than this show has so far. But anyway, as you may remember from past threads on this forum, I have little tolerance for Empire apologists. Maybe Andor has accomplished what you said because I haven't noticed anyone saying the Empire is not evil in this show. The two most common reactions I am seeing are people saying they love it, or people saying it is "sooo boring."
| Darklighter79 wrote: | In the last SWd20 there is a chapter about styles of play. One of them is immersive storytelling with an example of political turmoil in Senate. No focus on combat but on talking, developing in-depth personas, and character interaction. Basically whole sessions may pass without a single blaster being fired.
Now we have a ready tutorial for this: all the scenes with Mon Mothma (Senate, her house) and her interaction with Luthen. Perfect. |
I admit I would be quite bored running or playing in a campaign set-up like Andor. But I still love this show so far, because it is getting the gritty details of the Star Wars galaxy right IMO. Andor is sooo Star Wars!
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Mamatried
Commodore
Joined: 16 Dec 2017
Posts: 1854
Location: Norway
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| Posted: Thu Nov 10, 2022 5:37 pm Post subject: |
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Luthen Rael; Who is he?
What do we know? He seems to be a leader in the early rebellion, He is very wealthy and seems to be a collactor of the excitic artifacts of history, He seems to have some very queationable morality in his dealings at times, he seem very much more casual about life than the classic rebel alliance later
There are some online speculations that he may be both a force sensitive and even a sith. I find this to not be very likely, as we know the rule of two is at least for now Canon.
However, If we look at him and his actions and demeanor I will argue this guy is not a "good guy" he is what we would call one of the "bad guys" though in this case a bad guy fighting for the rebels, much like Saw Gurerra, an extrmeist and "dark" morally.
Now is there anything that would imply that Luthen is a sith or a force user, yes it is, the way he acts, some of the artifacts he seems to "hightlight" the way he manipulates and his total aura.........
Do I belive he is a sith? No, do I belive he is a force user, No, but I do belive he is a "dark sider" as to his morals and ethics and his fight against the empire is one very different than Leia's and others, this guys is a the "villain fighting for the herores" |
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TauntaunScout
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Joined: 20 Apr 2015
Posts: 981
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| Posted: Fri Nov 11, 2022 8:50 am Post subject: |
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| Whill wrote: |
And you seem to indicate that the newer franchise using flashbacks makes it not kid friendly, so by your criteria wouldn't that make it not a kids' franchise? And kids really love TM which is newer SW stuff, and it uses flashbacks.
| Darklighter79 wrote: | In the last SWd20 there is a chapter about styles of play. One of them is immersive storytelling with an example of political turmoil in Senate. No focus on combat but on talking, developing in-depth personas, and character interaction. Basically whole sessions may pass without a single blaster being fired.
Now we have a ready tutorial for this: all the scenes with Mon Mothma (Senate, her house) and her interaction with Luthen. Perfect. |
I admit I would be quite bored running or playing in a campaign set-up like Andor. But I still love this show so far, because it is getting the gritty details of the Star Wars galaxy right IMO. Andor is sooo Star Wars! |
The flashbacks aren't a deal breaker but I could do without so many of them, for the kids' sake. It makes the franchise less accessible. It fundamentally IS a kids franchise but one that always appealed to all generations. All the early interviews talk about it being "for young people" and its ability to grab the parents and even grandparents in '77 was part of the runaway success.
Yeah we tried little-to-no-combat fantasy RPG campaigns. Everyone leaves feeling indifferent and distracted. People want to roll their dice and make furious little notes. Combat much more readily provides that in an RPG. |
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Dredwulf60
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Joined: 07 Jan 2016
Posts: 911
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| Posted: Tue Nov 15, 2022 8:13 am Post subject: |
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The irony of Andor's arrest and incarceration...
Innocent of what he was arrested for, but he actually IS a thief and more importantly an enemy of the Empire.
He's been taken under a false name, and meanwhile they are hunting him like never before...yet they already have him.
Makes me ponder those serial killers who just seem to 'stop killing' before they're caught, and how many of them are actually in prison for other crimes. |
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Darklighter79
Captain
Joined: 27 May 2018
Posts: 529
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| Posted: Wed Nov 16, 2022 6:27 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | I admit I would be quite bored running or playing in a campaign set-up like Andor. But I still love this show so far, because it is getting the gritty details of the Star Wars galaxy right IMO. Andor is sooo Star Wars! |
That is why most of the adventures are described as "something-in-between" (in this case: Mon Mothma arc vs Andor arc)
10th episode has some of the strongest and soon-to-be-legendary dialogues since "I am your father". The quality bar has been set high...
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Vialco
Cadet
Joined: 07 Feb 2010
Posts: 7
Location: Ohio
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| Posted: Wed Nov 16, 2022 9:38 pm Post subject: |
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I'm hoping, and after ep 11 I had a small boost to my hope, that they are going to make him Corwin Shelvay. I can't explain why I think that but that's the call I'm making.
| Mamatried wrote: | Luthen Rael; Who is he?
What do we know? He seems to be a leader in the early rebellion, He is very wealthy and seems to be a collactor of the excitic artifacts of history, He seems to have some very queationable morality in his dealings at times, he seem very much more casual about life than the classic rebel alliance later
There are some online speculations that he may be both a force sensitive and even a sith. I find this to not be very likely, as we know the rule of two is at least for now Canon.
However, If we look at him and his actions and demeanor I will argue this guy is not a "good guy" he is what we would call one of the "bad guys" though in this case a bad guy fighting for the rebels, much like Saw Gurerra, an extrmeist and "dark" morally.
Now is there anything that would imply that Luthen is a sith or a force user, yes it is, the way he acts, some of the artifacts he seems to "hightlight" the way he manipulates and his total aura.........
Do I belive he is a sith? No, do I belive he is a force user, No, but I do belive he is a "dark sider" as to his morals and ethics and his fight against the empire is one very different than Leia's and others, this guys is a the "villain fighting for the herores" |
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Sutehp
Commodore
Joined: 01 Nov 2016
Posts: 1797
Location: Washington, DC (AKA Inside the Beltway)
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| Posted: Fri Nov 18, 2022 1:11 am Post subject: |
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I agree that Andor took its time to build up, but it was worth the wait. I don't need action in the first few episodes if the story is building to something later.
I'm loving this show and can't wait to see the season finale/Episode 12 to see how they wrap up this story arc. And I can't wait to see K-2SO in Season 2!
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Just repurchased the X-Wing and Tie Fighter flight sim games. I forgot how much I missed them. |
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Whill
Dark Lord of the Jedi (Owner/Admin)
Joined: 14 Apr 2008
Posts: 10402
Location: Columbus, Ohio, USA, Earth, The Solar System, The Milky Way Galaxy
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| Posted: Fri Nov 18, 2022 2:10 am Post subject: |
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I'm caught up again. Still loving this show. Luthen's tractor countermeasure was interesting.
My idea for one was to launch a torpedo at the tractor beam projector so the tractor beam would pull the torpedo toward the projector, and then the tractor operator would be forced to release the ship in hopes of steering the torpedo away from the projector.
But what the Luthen's ship had works too.
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Whill
Dark Lord of the Jedi (Owner/Admin)
Joined: 14 Apr 2008
Posts: 10402
Location: Columbus, Ohio, USA, Earth, The Solar System, The Milky Way Galaxy
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| Posted: Sun Nov 20, 2022 10:08 pm Post subject: |
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I had watched parts 10 and 11 back to back. I wanted to go back to 10 and post this...
| Quote: | LONNI: And what do you sacrifice?”
LUTHEN: Calm. Kindness. Kinship. Love. I’ve given up all chance at inner peace. I’ve made my mind a sunless space. I share my dreams with ghosts. I wake up every day to an equation I wrote fifteen years ago from which there’s only one conclusion, I’m damned for what I do. My anger, my ego, my unwillingness to yield, my eagerness to fight, they’ve set me on a path from which there is no escape. I yearned to be a savior against injustice without contemplating the cost and by the time I looked down… there was no longer any ground beneath my feet. What is my… What is my sacrifice? I’m condemned to use the tools of my enemy to defeat them. I burn my decency for someone else’s future. I burn my life to make a sunrise that I know I’ll never see. And the ego that started this fight will never have a mirror or an audience or the light of gratitude. So what do I sacrifice? Everything! |
That's some damn good writing!
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Darklighter79
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Joined: 27 May 2018
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| Posted: Mon Nov 21, 2022 2:05 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Kino Loy: Right now, the building is ours. You need to run, climb, kill! You need to help each other. You see someone who's confused, someone who is lost, you get them moving and you keep them moving until we put this place behind us. There are 5,000 of us. If we can fight half as hard as we've been working, we will be home in no time. One way out! One way out! |
A successful Command roll at a dramatically appropriate moment.
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Whill
Dark Lord of the Jedi (Owner/Admin)
Joined: 14 Apr 2008
Posts: 10402
Location: Columbus, Ohio, USA, Earth, The Solar System, The Milky Way Galaxy
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| Posted: Mon Nov 21, 2022 10:18 pm Post subject: |
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| Darklighter79 wrote: | | Quote: | | Kino Loy: Right now, the building is ours. You need to run, climb, kill! You need to help each other. You see someone who's confused, someone who is lost, you get them moving and you keep them moving until we put this place behind us. There are 5,000 of us. If we can fight half as hard as we've been working, we will be home in no time. One way out! One way out! |
A successful Command roll at a dramatically appropriate moment. |
I agree, although it is not really an order. This is why I expanded the skill to command/leadership, to inspire others by leadership.
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pakman
Commander
Joined: 20 Jul 2021
Posts: 430
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| Posted: Thu Nov 24, 2022 7:39 pm Post subject: |
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Absolutely amazing.
not just good star wars - but just plain good show in general.
Excellent writing, directing - and incredible acting.
Instead of trying to make some characters smart by surrounding them with idiots - they are smart by what they do and how they do it.
So many nuances in so many areas - from plots, subplots - implications - personalities etc. Love how the antagonists are not necessarily "evil" or sithlike or just crazy (well....cyril's mom might ...) - they are in their minds the good guys.
Oh, and keno loy - awesome - seeing him who and what he is - and how he changes - so much just with the facial expressions - and then andor, metaphorically taking on the luthen's role as giving keno his call to action just as luthen had given andor his in ep3. The build up hit an amazing moment with "never more than 12" - such a simple line - but so well written with everything else.
The music and cinematography is excellent as well - just the symbolism of the scene where luthen was taking to his contact - one guy is alone but in the open - the other appears to be trapped in a cell (the elevator) - great imagery.
not to mention the abundance of easter eggs and sw references.
I could continue to gush - but dang, that was some very fine star wars.
While it is set a bit later than my current game (we are a couple of years earlier ) - it is a great glimpse into parts of life in the empire and my players and I all love it.
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