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| What is your favorite Star Wars film? |
| Star Wars: A New Hope |
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34% |
[ 15 ] |
| The Empire Strikes Back |
|
29% |
[ 13 ] |
| Return of the Jedi |
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6% |
[ 3 ] |
| The Phantom Menace |
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2% |
[ 1 ] |
| Attack of the Clones |
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0% |
[ 0 ] |
| Revenge of the Sith |
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4% |
[ 2 ] |
| Solo |
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2% |
[ 1 ] |
| Rogue One |
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20% |
[ 9 ] |
| The Force Awakens |
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0% |
[ 0 ] |
| The Last Jedi |
|
0% |
[ 0 ] |
| The Rise of Skywalker |
|
0% |
[ 0 ] |
|
| Total Votes : 44 |
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| Author |
Message |
Whill
Dark Lord of the Jedi (Owner/Admin)
Joined: 14 Apr 2008
Posts: 10435
Location: Columbus, Ohio, USA, Earth, The Solar System, The Milky Way Galaxy
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 Posted: Mon May 16, 2022 10:02 pm Post subject: Re: Attack of the Clones |
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| TauntaunScout wrote: | | Whill wrote: | | but there is also a lot to like about it. |
1) It reads almost *exactly* like a West End adventure a teenage GM would've written at home. Even some of the worst parts would've been awesome if, instead of happening at the movies, had happened as a result of PC wit ha terrible/great idea that succeeded/failed because of the Wild Die and left the GM scrambling to come up with something. |
Interesting. The PT (this film included) showed that Lucas is awesome at writing and directing action sequences. The Coruscant Chase, Kenobi vs. Fett, the Droid Factory, etc. I can say I definitely have been influenced by them in devising adventures.
The second part of an adventure I ran even took place on Geonosis during the Battle of Geonosis. It quickly lead to offscreen activities and the final "boss" was General Grievous (before he was fully cyborged) in the droid factory.
| TauntaunScout wrote: | | Like C-3PO getting turned into a battle droid. Even though we hated it when it came out, my brother and I agreed that it seemed really fun if you reimaginged it as someone wrote down what happened in their West End RPG campaign and then made that as a movie |
I love the Threepio bits, now and back then.
| TauntaunScout wrote: | | 2) The very understated signs of the Republic turning into the Empire were cool. Like the logo on Obi-Wan's ship. |
Not just the logo–Obi-Wan's ship too, which was intentionally designed to evoke a star destroyer, scaled down to a starfighter.
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Grimace
Captain
Joined: 11 Oct 2004
Posts: 729
Location: Montana; Big Sky Country
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| Posted: Wed May 18, 2022 9:29 am Post subject: |
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| Dr. Bidlo wrote: | | There were several things I really disliked about the most recent trilogy, the Holdo Move, lighspace skipping, and force teleporting to name a few, but I did actually enjoy the movies overall. I just don't see them as canon IMSU... |
Do you realize the "force teleporting", as you put it, was actually established quite a while ago in the Dark Empire comic when it first came out.
It's actually one of the few things I actually liked about the 2nd sequel movie, because they did such a nod to the Star Wars comics (and West End Games Star Wars). |
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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010
Posts: 16320
Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
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| Posted: Wed May 18, 2022 1:09 pm Post subject: |
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| Grimace wrote: | | Do you realize the "force teleporting", as you put it, was actually established quite a while ago in the Dark Empire comic when it first came out. |
Where was this? The closest thing I can think of was ultimately explained as the Doppelganger power, a powerful illusion, not teleportation.
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Forceally
Commodore
Joined: 20 Feb 2007
Posts: 1061
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| Posted: Wed May 18, 2022 10:24 pm Post subject: |
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| CRMcNeill wrote: | | Grimace wrote: | | Do you realize the "force teleporting", as you put it, was actually established quite a while ago in the Dark Empire comic when it first came out. |
Where was this? The closest thing I can think of was ultimately explained as the Doppelganger power, a powerful illusion, not teleportation. |
I think he's talking about the Force power create Force storms. It's what Palpatine used to create that cosmic storm/vortex that took Luke and R2 to that Imperial prison ship bound for Byss. He created another one to attack the Rebel fleet orbiting Da Soocha V. He lost control of it when Luke and Leia used Force harmony on him, causing the vortex to consume the Eclipse. |
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Antilles
Lieutenant
Joined: 06 Feb 2021
Posts: 76
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| Posted: Thu May 19, 2022 5:47 pm Post subject: |
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My ranking (please, don't hate me and remember that hate leads to the Dark Side  )
1. ESB (V)
2. ANH (IV)
3. ROTS (III)
4. R1
5. ROTJ (VI)
6. AOTC (II)
7. Solo
8. TPM (I)
9. Sequel Trilogy (I cannot say which one I liked more than other. They have great moments, but the story arc is "meh" for me). |
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Whill
Dark Lord of the Jedi (Owner/Admin)
Joined: 14 Apr 2008
Posts: 10435
Location: Columbus, Ohio, USA, Earth, The Solar System, The Milky Way Galaxy
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| Posted: Thu May 19, 2022 7:18 pm Post subject: |
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Antilles, you're good!
| Forceally wrote: | | CRMcNeill wrote: | | Grimace wrote: |
Dr. Bidlo wrote: | | There were several things I really disliked about the most recent trilogy, the Holdo Move, lighspace skipping, and force teleporting to name a few, but I did actually enjoy the movies overall. I just don't see them as canon IMSU... |
Do you realize the "force teleporting", as you put it, was actually established quite a while ago in the Dark Empire comic when it first came out. |
Where was this? The closest thing I can think of was ultimately explained as the Doppelganger power, a powerful illusion, not teleportation. |
I think he's talking about the Force power create Force storms. It's what Palpatine used to create that cosmic storm/vortex that took Luke and R2 to that Imperial prison ship bound for Byss. He created another one to attack the Rebel fleet orbiting Da Soocha V. He lost control of it when Luke and Leia used Force harmony on him, causing the vortex to consume the Eclipse. |
I think you're right about what Grimace is referring to, the "Force Storm/Hyperspace Wormhole". There is no question that after Abrams scrambled for an Episode IX story and Lucas suggested that he bring back Palpatine, Abrams was inspired by the Dark Empire comic series.
However, the Force teleporting that was in the DT is not very much like as the Force storm in DE. Force storm was a volatile dark side Force power which required extreme anger and hatred to violently destroy the fabric of the space-time continuum by opening dimension-altering rifts in the universe. Force storms were incredibly difficult to control once unleashed and required mastery in many different Force disciplines. The comic book author who created it said, "The Emperor can't create Force Storms at will. They are in fact a phenomenon that occurs rarely, when the minds of two great Force users meet and struggle with each other at a distance." What happened in the DT was just poof – an object instantly, silently disappears and reappears somewhere else. In TRoS, it even happened between two light side individuals.
In the DT, the Force works like magic. No, it wasn't the first time in the franchise. The Ewok TV movies and series commonly had the Force work as magic. Just because something appeared in the franchise before, doesn't mean it should appear in a film. Star Wars films weren't expected to be like the comic books and cartoons.
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Whill
Dark Lord of the Jedi (Owner/Admin)
Joined: 14 Apr 2008
Posts: 10435
Location: Columbus, Ohio, USA, Earth, The Solar System, The Milky Way Galaxy
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CommanderFocs
Ensign
Joined: 10 Oct 2021
Posts: 30
Location: A galaxy far far away
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| Posted: Wed Jun 15, 2022 6:41 pm Post subject: My Rankings |
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Ranking all 11 Star Wars movies is very difficult for me, but I can fairly easily rank each film (minus Rogue One and Solo) in their respective trilogy.
Prequals: 1st place goes to Revenge of the Sith, 2nd place goes to Phantom Menace, and 3rd place goes to Attack of the Clones
Originals: 1st place goes to Return of the Jedi, 2nd place goes to A New Hope, and 3rd place goes to Empire Strikes Back
Sequels: 1st place goes to Force Awakens, but it's honestly a toss up for 2nd place between Last Jedi and Rise of Skywalker. I don't like either movie that much, so its hard to say one is better than the other.
I do like Rogue One more than Solo though.
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Whill
Dark Lord of the Jedi (Owner/Admin)
Joined: 14 Apr 2008
Posts: 10435
Location: Columbus, Ohio, USA, Earth, The Solar System, The Milky Way Galaxy
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| Posted: Thu Nov 23, 2023 12:43 am Post subject: |
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This is a real fanzine cease-publication letter from 1981...
| Quote: | | Over the past months it has become increasingly clear to us that we cannot continue publishing a fanzine for a movie in which we find so little to recommend… fandom is fractured… no one has any clear idea of what the film is really all about… For us, TESB left out the most important ingredient: love--from which flowed an innocent sense of fun... It is not for us any great piece of literature, philosophy or religion… To us, TESB is a dead thing with no life. We are not the only fans, fan editors, or SW enthusiasts who have jumped ship, either. Several prominent zine editors have let us know their misgivings and at least two others have washed their hands of the sequel and the 'future' of the SW saga. |
There is a great diversity in the fandom, even among the cross-section of fans at the Pit. But I feel it safe to say that our fandoms don't diverge this early in the franchise. None of us "jumped ship" in response to TESB. These are fans who enjoyed the original film but the first sequel in 1980 didn't cut it for them. They have been out of the fandom for over 40 years now.
It was funny to see that TESB, which is widely considered the best SW film, was hated by a vocal minority of fans back then. Before seeing this today, among the CT films I had only heard of RotJ dividing in the fandom, theorized to be due to The Ewok Line. If age was a factor, I am an anomaly because I was a little over the Ewok Line in 1983 and I still found them entertaining (I still do.)
But maybe age has something to do with it here? It is my understanding that these fanzine publishers were late teens. Their audience was likely late teens and adult fans. I was in elementary school for the CT. The first two Star Wars films were loved by all my friends. The experience of TESB's aftermath did suck because of the cliffhanger aspects – We were all dying to see what happened next. We debated about whether Han would be revived and whether Vader was lying to Luke about his parentage reveal. It only sucked because we loved it so much and wanted more. So my age-range seemed to still be all-in for Star Wars, but I guess there were older fans with the experience of TESB not making them feel like they felt for ANH so they dropped support for the franchise.
I know for sure age had something to do with the minority of fandom backlash against the PT. Several of my high school friends, a lot of them teenaged players in my WEG SW 1e days, were all-in for the whole CT, but didn't care for the PT in their late 20s/early 30s. Many of their criticisms of the PT could easily be applied to the CT as well, but the difference was they had no nostalgia-goggles for the PT. A lot of users of this site over the years fall into a similar age-range and experience of the PT. But I digress.
Anyway, there you have it. TESB-haters among SW fans. They do exist!
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KageRyu
Commodore
Joined: 06 Jul 2005
Posts: 1391
Location: Lost in the cracks
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| Posted: Sat Nov 25, 2023 7:31 pm Post subject: |
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That just truly astounds me. I have loved ESB since first seeing it. It instantly became my favorite. I personally feel it is the second greatest thing to come from the Star Wars franchise, and by the time it came out I had watched and re-watched Star Wars a few dozen of times on cable and on VHS (recorded off cable). There was a time I could almost quote the first movie word for word, having watched it any and every chance I got.
To read a fanzine termination letter where the fans seem to dread the release of ESB just makes me question the point of life... Am I even still in my own universe or did I get Mandella'd again?
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DougRed4
Rear Admiral
Joined: 18 Jan 2013
Posts: 2286
Location: Seattle, WA
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| Posted: Thu Nov 30, 2023 3:32 pm Post subject: |
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| Whill wrote: | | It was funny to see that TESB, which is widely considered the best SW film, was hated by a vocal minority of fans back then. Before seeing this today, among the CT films I had only heard of RotJ dividing in the fandom, theorized to be due to The Ewok Line. If age was a factor, I am an anomaly because I was a little over the Ewok Line in 1983 and I still found them entertaining (I still do.) |
That was a shocker. I wonder if any of them have since returned to the franchise as fans. Or if any of them changed their views about ESB over time.
I might be misunderstanding, Whill, but if you are over (to the right of) the Ewok Line, don't you fall into the norm (of liking them), rather than being an anomaly? I am to the left of the line, so am normal in my dislike of the furry critters.
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Whill
Dark Lord of the Jedi (Owner/Admin)
Joined: 14 Apr 2008
Posts: 10435
Location: Columbus, Ohio, USA, Earth, The Solar System, The Milky Way Galaxy
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| Posted: Thu Nov 30, 2023 10:57 pm Post subject: |
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| DougRed4 wrote: | | Whill wrote: | | It was funny to see that TESB, which is widely considered the best SW film, was hated by a vocal minority of fans back then. Before seeing this today, among the CT films I had only heard of RotJ dividing in the fandom, theorized to be due to The Ewok Line. If age was a factor, I am an anomaly because I was a little over the Ewok Line in 1983 and I still found them entertaining (I still do.) |
That was a shocker. I wonder if any of them have since returned to the franchise as fans. Or if any of them changed their views about ESB over time.
I might be misunderstanding, Whill, but if you are over (to the right of) the Ewok Line, don't you fall into the norm (of liking them), rather than being an anomaly? I am to the left of the line, so am normal in my dislike of the furry critters. |
Oh, on the terminology you are quite right. I was thinking over as in 'over the age of.' But as for birthdate, yes, it would be correct to say before/left. I am from the early 70s. Sorry for the confusion.
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