What will be The future of Thrawn.

[Mamatried]

Having read the first of the new Thrawn novels, I realized it ended "long before" the events of Rebels.

With these events being canon, and thus most likely the book leading up to this, the new bok will not offer any light on Ezra and Thrawn's fate after rebels.

BUT what I was wondering, looking at how Thrawn was thinking and waht Actually Drove him.

My question to you guys is this: Could it be reasonably possible that Thrawn, would be enemy to the first order and side with the resistance IF encountering both sides?

Could he in theory be one of the "allies in the outer rim" or beyond?

I mean as to episode 9 timeline, or the upcoming Live action tv series

[Whill]

[Sutehp]

I can't see Thrawn allying with the Resistance for any reason. He's very much a "might makes right" guy, so seeing him join forces with a totally outmatched force like the Resistance would be completely out of character for him. The idea that Thrawn would somehow pull a Heel-Face Turn and become one of the Resistance's "outer rim allies" is almost as stupid as the Star Wars Holiday Special.

As to whether Thrawn would align himself with the First Order, that's far more uncertain. The First Order isn't the Empire; I'm not even certain why anyone loyal to the latter would feel any fealty to the former. Aside from a "might makes right" mentality and the stormtrooper uniforms, there doesn't seem to be much ideology connecting the two regimes. The Empire was loyal to Palpatine; the First Order followed Snoke. And there doesn't seem to be any sort of connection (that we know of) between Palpatine and Snoke that would explain how Snoke got to be Palpatine's successor. Without that connection, what reason would Thrawn have to be loyal to the First Order? Thrawn was loyal to the Emperor, but the Emperor is dead. Who would Thrawn serve now? What reason would Thrawn have to be loyal to Snoke?

And with Kylo Ren usurping Snoke, all of the First Order now has to decide if they're truly going to transfer their loyalties to Kylo Ren after the disaster on Crait made Kylo Ren look like a fool. If Thrawn had little reason to ally with Snoke, then it seems even more unlikely that he'd ally with a childish incompetent like Kylo Ren.
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[Whill]

The First Order would also be a dumb name for a successor state. If Snoke is Darth Plagueis, then the Empire may be an unsuccessful expansion of a previously existing First Order.

Why would Thrawn be loyal to Palpatine and the Empire? Appreciation of military authoritarianism? The First Order has that too. Yes, the First Order is now lead by a whiny Dark Side Force user, but why did Thrawn work with an insane clone of a Jedi master in Legends? They used each other to serve their their own ends. Thrawn and Kylo Ren could do that too. Isn't Chiss Space near the Unknown Regions? Maybe Thrawn needs the support of the First Order to keep his Chiss enemies at bay.

So while it is possible they could work out some kind of relationship, I still think it is unlikely they will use Thrawn in Episode IX.
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[Sutehp]

[Mamatried]

I personally would see a Thrawn in Ep 9, but at the timeline, IF still alive
Would He as we know him from both eu and canon, be one to ally with upstarts? And in all fairness FO are/was/is upstarts at best.

Or would he support, or aid in some way a republic or something.

Basically would Thrawn be a FO if still alive

[Grimace]

[Solo4114]

[Whill]

[Grimace]

I don't want to get too "spoiler-y" for the Aftermath books, unless I get the go-ahead to be spoiler-ville.

[MrNexx]

[Whill]

[Grimace]

Okay then.

As it was explained in Aftermath: Empire's End, the Emperor had taken the knowledge of Thrawn's life in the Unknown Regions to had his sites set on the area beyond that...an area outside the galaxy.

He had spent a number of years, combining the knowledge of Thrawn with long range probes sent further and further out into the Unknown Regions.

When each probe was lost, they would dispatch more probes along the route that went the furthest, and keep finding way further and further out...out so far it even went beyond the boundaries of the galaxy.

In Aftermath: Empire's End, a crazed, power-mad fellow by the name of Gallius Rax (he went by both Grand Admiral and Counselor, so he was just a manipulator of things who had the favor of Palpatine) was responsible for the drive beyond the Unknown Regions.

He took the remaining Imperial fleet, a rather impressive fleet with the last Super Star Destroyer, to Jakku, the place where he was originally from. There the Empire met it's end in a giant battle (you can see the remnants of the battle in The Force Awakens).

Before the battle, the Empire was there on Jakku for months, and they used a local Hutt, Nima the Hutt, to collect children. They took those children and indoctrinated them, trained them, got them to pledge service to PEOPLE rather than an ideal or to the Empire. These children were trained and indoctrinated by Brendol Hux. Brendol Hux was an Imperial.

Gallius Rax manipulated things to have Brendol's son tormented and picked on, then elevated the boy by having all of the other children pledge their loyalty to the boy, a little red-headed Hux who eventually grew up to become General Hux of the First Order.

Gallius Rax wanted to reinvent the power, but he had seen it crumble and collapse after the death of the Emperor. So he set out to destroy all those who were loyal to the Empire, and the Imperial ideals. So in the end, it is inferred that the Rax would have little Hux order the death of his father, and would take over command of the children as they grew up.

It was mentioned in the book, that the "first order" of business was to build anew, with new focus, no more beholden to the ideals of the Empire. No more allegiance to the Emperor. Instead, they would follow whomever was in charge, and be indoctrinated from young age. This coincides with what Finn was mentioning in the Force Awakens about being take as a child. For him to break that indoctrination was a notable, and challenging thing. It's also why he was so scared of the First Order. They are fanatics, not a "hired" or "volunteered" army. The don't follow an ideal, other than that they want to cleanse the galaxy of everything that doesn't demonstrate obedience to the First Order.

I think they took the "first order" of business, and just decided that, rather than being an Empire, as they controlled nothing at that time, they would simply be the "First Order".

The one thing, besides a dozen or so random ships that carried a host of trained children out beyond the edge of the galaxy, was Palpatine's personal ship, the Eclipse. From the Eclipse, they took what was available and created stuff anew. They conquered planets with it, and formed bases from which the build up.

That's how they were able to build something like Starkiller Base without being detected.... or building the fleet of new Star Destroyers without anyone finding out about it. They were all developed beyond the Unknown Regions, and then came back along the same path they used to get out.

In the meantime, the New Republic was already in the mindset of drawing down their forces prior to the battle of Jakku. After that battle, it was assumed that the Empire was finally, completely defeated. (If fact, it was.)
So they drew down their armed forces, wanting each member planet to have their own defenses rather than one strong central defense...which they were worried would allow someone like Palpatine to take power and have the forces to enforce things.

After an event on Chandrila, it was decided to move the center of the New Republic to another world. Even then, there was talk of keeping the seat of power "on the move" to provide benefit to multiple planets, rather than having just one benefit. And they didn't want to emulate concept of one planet with rule over all, all the time. In the three books, the capital moves from Chandrila to another world. In the Force Awakens, it's on another world. It fits with the concept that was laid down in the books. As does the lack of military that the New Republic seemed to have in the Force Awakens.

Leia had already gone "rogue" once in the trilogy of books, in order to free Kashyyk. She almost did it for the Battle of Jakku. So I'm sure, based on the establishment set in the books, she would do it again when the New Republic votes to drastically drawn down the New Republic military. Thus, that is why she is "in rebellion" against the New Republic, and General Leia rather than Alderanian Princess Leia.

Likewise, the books also show why it was likely Han Solo was not around all that much when Ben Solo was growing up, and why Kylo Ren had such a soft spot for his mother and not for his father.

But at the time of the books, there was no mention of Snoke, nor was their any obvious Force users brought with the children. The one adviser to Palpatine, who was a devotee to the Dark Side, was killed in the last book by Gallius Rax, along with him destroying a number of powerful Sith artifacts. This was all done on Jakku, so there is adventure fodder for things that could be done on Jakku if someone wanted to run an adventure there.

The highest "ranking" person was a badly injured Grand Admiral, who probably didn't make it very long before dying, and Brendol Hux who I am sure would be killed by his son and the loyal children who pledge to follow him. I'm guessing somewhere out there they met Snoke and he used the Force to impress young Hux. From that, they grew in strength.

I can't say how Ben Solo ends up in the First Order, or when the First Order made its way back into the known Star Wars galaxy. It could have been about the same time, by the look of the age of Ben Solo when Luke had his encounter with him which turned Ben Solo to the Dark Side.

But I can say that Snoke was not an Imperial, nor was Hux, nor most other people you see in the First Order. Those Imperials who did make it out there would probably have either sworn obedience to the First Order or been killed off by the fanatical First Order children/warriors.

The First Order, though their equipment have Imperial lineage (TIEs, wedge shaped Star Destroyers, white armor for their Stormtroopers, etc.) they are definitely NOT Imperials! They are fanatics loyal to Hux, loyal to people in power, and beholden to the belief that they are superior, and everyone else is inferior. They want to kill all who will not join. They capture children to make more troops, as they are best to indoctrinate and most malleable to work with. They do not enlist non-indoctrinated people. You either submit to be ruled by them, or you die.

[Whill]

Thanks, Grimace! That was very informational. I was aware of a couple of the broad strokes, like a bit of the Hux backstory and the start of the First Order Stormtrooper corps. I have read that there is a fan-loved YA novel that deals with Leia and the New Republic, Bloodline. It takes place 6 years before TFA and sounds like it might be right up your ally.

It sounds like Wendig was issued a restraining order on talking about Snoke, and an obvious reason for that would be because they wanted to leave that open to possibly be dealt with in the films. Lucas did stuff like that all the time with the pre-prequels EU.

When the First Order indoctrinates loyalty to whomever is in charge of the First Order, that is loyalty to the First Order above any one person. The Supreme Leader changes, the center of the loyalty shifts but it stays in the First Order. The Empire didn't command that kind of loyalty which is probably a big factor in why it failed so quickly after Palpatine died. It was all built upon Palpatine. He didn't establish any successor rules because he planned on finding a way to live forever. He didn't plan on being succeeded by an apprentice Sith Lord. He wasn't in denial of the past succession of the Sith Order leading to his rule, but there was no accounting for subsequent succession after him.

Above when I responded to the statement that the First Order was a successor to the Empire by stating the possibility that the Empire may have been more of an unsuccessful expansion of the First Order, I didn't mean that too literally. I meant that, in the fan theory that Snoke is Plagueis, Plagueis could have fled to the Unknown Regions when Palpatine thought he had killed him. Plagueis could have predicted the Empire that Palpatine would make and thought it would serve his masterplan well. It did lead to a pacifist New Republic with a lot of battle weary planets ripe for conquest. Plagueis could have taken over the First Order as part of his plan to control the whole galaxy.

I hope that Plagueis theory is not true. I hope Snoke is Snoke, and he is really dead. I find a Kylo Ren lead First Order to be a lot more interesting. But in JJ Abrams's TFA, Ren said to Han, "The Supreme Leader is wise." It seemed like a particular odd phasing for that part of the discussion, so that could be a reference to "Darth Plagueis the Wise". JJ Abrams is also doing Episode IX. I still think the Snoke=Plagueis theory is still not ruled out, and it is the direction JJ may take it. They said that Episode IX would include elements of the prequels, and Snoke being Plagueis (or perhaps being an apprentice of Plagueis) would be a prequel element.

But we digress from the future of Thrawn.
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[Falconer]

I don’t think they will tinker with Thrawn’s career too much. As a signature character of Legends, I think the intent was to port him over to Canon more or less reverentially as an olive branch to Legends fans. My theory is that the Benioff/Weiss film series will be an adaptation of the original Thrawn Campaign, set in roughly the same timeframe (5 years post-RotJ), and broadly falling out the same way.