Which edition?

[Grimace]

I'm a 2nd edition person myself. Even though I played 1st edition, the books I purchased were 2nd edition and I liked what they had. R&E had lost of neat bells and whistles, but I didn't like the changing of the scale rules (who needs more dice?) and there were some other teeny things that just made me go "eh, no thanks". So I stick with regular 2nd edition when I game.

[Morpheus Grifullkin]

The 2nd Ed. RAE is my favorite. I've played it with my dad and his friends.
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Morpheus Grifullkin
AKA
Kronn Grifullkin

[Allst Beamem]

[Morpheus Grifullkin]

16
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Morpheus Grifullkin
AKA
Kronn Grifullkin

[TarlSS]

I play D20 and D6

I say I prefer D20 because it's cleaner and more intuitive. You throw a grenade, you make a reflex save, it hurts everybody. You don't have some crazy thing where a thermal detonator doesn't hurt someone because they made a dodge. That's ridiculous.

It's balanced. Jedi can't do everything in the game through the use of a couple of Force Skills. Even though classes are restrictive, it forces a real party dynamic. There isn't some glory-hog Jedi that can do everything and everyone else gets forced to the sidelines. Everyone gets a chance to shine at what they do.

It's played and in print. I can find far more D20 games than I can D6. Books are easy to find. That's a fact.

D6 is nice because it's fast and messy. The rules are all over the damn place. Everyone's constantly confused and flipping through pages. Everything is intentionally vauged. It's cinematic, but sometimes I want to throw the book across the room and curl up in a corner from all the chaos.

Some people like structured and ordered play. I like structured and ordered play. I like Races and classes balanced to be equal. I would prefer to sacrifice game mechanics that are "true" to the movies in favor of ones that actually make a fair game. Because frankly, any two-bit hack of a writer can make a fine description of whatever happens with the dice. What's important in a gaming system is not the setting, but the mathematical mechanics. Because flavor and setting while your actually playing is provided by the GM and the players, not the gaming company that sits in the background.

[KageRyu]

[Volar the Healer]

[KageRyu]

[Lord Aramus]

D20 takes everything from Ad&D and D&D that was good and wholesome.... and blatantly throws it out the window in favor of charts and modifiers.

I'll take my simple chart of d6 difficulty scales any day
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There are alot of cool places in the world. Alaska is one of them.
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[Orgaloth]

Everyone is entitled to their opinion. If they can't be botheredto read the rules and learn them (both D6 and D20) then of course they are going to say that a system is broken.
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"I take orders from just one person: Me!"

"You know, sometimes I amaze even myself."
Du Cass' Dream

[Endwyn]

Every system has it's flaws. Even D6, because no system can be perfect. D6 is one of the best ones I've seen because of it's simplicity. Although in the case of bashing the new D20 system, it would be hard to not jump on that bandwagon. Sorry, but it's true.

One of the easiest gripe for any D20 game line could easily be feats. The whole idea of feats, as presented, becomes less about customizing a character with feats and more about buying them. I mean, you might as well pay the GM $20 and just make your own feat. Each book prints more and more feats, some books making old ones obsolete because of the "one-up" factor of some of the books. If you don't keep up with all the books, therby having all the feats, you character won't be on the same playing field as another PC who's player buys all the books and has them available to make his character.

Another could be that to make a really good character you have to work out the details (feats being a big one) all the way to the target level you expect the character to reach. You really have to think about when you take which feat and how that leads to the larger goal.

Or the fact that now multiclassing is a true burden instead of a character opportunity.

Last one could be that the whole system is geared towards tactical combat and not role-playing. The rules for combat and the feats that effect them make it difficult to run combat rounds quickly or easily. And the game now slants towards it.

I really don't want to get into a debate over systems, I really like D20 for D&D. Some of the stuff is definatly a step forward, but I'm not really sure if overall it isn't one really big step backwards. My point is really that every system has faults and that the people who see them are usually those who don't read the rules and those who really know them. But D20 isn't the only one with system faults.

I don't know what tone you intended for your post, but it comes across as if your talking down to Lord Aramus, telling him he must not know the system if he sees faults.
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Luke, I am your father.
That's impossible!
And Leia is your sister!
That's improbable?
And the Empire will be destroyed by..EWOKS!
That's...highly unlikely.
The Force? Bacteria called midichlorians.
If you don’t take this seriously I'm out.

[Orgaloth]

I guess I'm not coming through clearly, which is one reason I rarely post in the Forums proper.

All I'm saying is, If you don't know the ins and outs of a system, any system it may very well appear broken.

I have played both D20 and D6 Star Wars, and I much prefere D6, mainly because I know the sytem better, but also because I didn't think the D20 had the right feel. To me it was cumbersome, but that may be from the fact I didn't know the system too well.

I hope I cleared myself up. Even a little.
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"I take orders from just one person: Me!"

"You know, sometimes I amaze even myself."
Du Cass' Dream

[Endwyn]

I understand where your coming from, but the previous poster may very well have a great deal of experience with D20. I was only trying to demenstrate that D20 does have flaws, problems, and issues; but not to pick on it that ever system does. (Although I do think D20's issues are more frequent and more dramatic than most other popular systems.) I didn't think you really meant to come off as telling the poster they must not know they system if they think it's flawed. If you didn't mean it, then I was mearly pointing out how it could be taken; if you did mean it then I was siding with him that D20 does have issues, as every system has it's issues. D6 for example can be over simplistic to a fault at times. Athough I would much rather the system be a little too simplistic than the system be bogged down with hundreds of complex rules to do something simple.

I figure you you weren't trying to imply he obviously doesn't know the rules if they see the system as broken, and just let you know how it might be taken - as a friendly FYI, not as a put down. (Happy forum.......think Happpppppy thoughts. F it, where's the prozac!)



Just Kidding......................this isn't a happy forum. Could someone open the child-proof bottle for me?
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Luke, I am your father.
That's impossible!
And Leia is your sister!
That's improbable?
And the Empire will be destroyed by..EWOKS!
That's...highly unlikely.
The Force? Bacteria called midichlorians.
If you don’t take this seriously I'm out.

[Boomer]

I know D20 very well... and when the authors who wrote the books cannot stop arguing with each other, and contradict what they have written in both the book, the FAQ to explain the book, and the errata to correct the book, something is wrong.

D20 is convoluted, it CANNOT be understood properly because it was never made with any thought about sensible rules in mind, at any point. In the end it is all contradictory suggestions and you are better off playing something more concrete, or making something up.

Driving a landspeeder at night, no lights. Same thing just to go forward, does he have landspeeder skill? If something comes up, the darkness increases the difficulty of everything sight based by two dice. I run a Star Wars game without a single book or Table in front of me, just a handful of dice. It is all I need, the rest is easily commited to memory for me.
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My backpack has jets!
I'm Boba the Fett!
And I bounty hunt for Jabba Hutt,
to finance my 'vette!

[Endwyn]

The designers admited their own system was broken. (Not in words, but actions.) No one, I mean no one, releaes a revision to a game design in less than a year that supercedes and replaces the old information and books unless the system was broken. And many would argue they still didn't fix the problems, just some of the bugs.
_________________
Luke, I am your father.
That's impossible!
And Leia is your sister!
That's improbable?
And the Empire will be destroyed by..EWOKS!
That's...highly unlikely.
The Force? Bacteria called midichlorians.
If you don’t take this seriously I'm out.