Back In The Saddle

[DougRed4]

While it's true that a character can do just about anything, I think most GMs do something similar to vanir (above), by reflecting things with the difficulty of the TN.

So that character in garhkal's example might find his task to be difficult (based on his unfamiliarity), which might make it very difficult for the character to succeed.

[Under Pale Gray Skies]

A lot of this is coming back to me. In some ways it doesnt make sense, but then again, thats very star wars.

Another question:
Do you have to declare your intent to dodge at the beginning of the round, or can you wait until you are fired at?

[cheshire]

IIRC you can do either. Under the R&E (Revised and Expanded) rule set you can use dodge as a reaction skill. Reaction skills are a set of defensive skills that do not need to be declared, but they still suffer from MAPs (multiple action penalties). Alternatively, you can declare you are using a full dodge, which means you roll your full dodge skill die code, but can do nothing else that turn.

Does that help?
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Before we take any of this too seriously, just remember that in the middle episode a little rubber puppet moves a spaceship with his mind.

[Guardian_A]

For the full rules on Reaction and Multiple actions, check R&E: p78-79. There are some good examples for both kinds of actions.

As a GM, I have my players declare how many actions they want to take at the beginning of the round. And if they take more actions than they declare, they take an additional 1D penalty to every additional roll during the turn. (I had too many players trying to abuse the RAW before I started adding to the penalty. The change made them a lot more responsible with their choices.)

[CRMcNeill]

Don't feel you have to restrict yourself to just the skills on the list as reaction skills. I allow Force users to use TK to make reaction parries against thrown objects, such as knives, grenades, or TK'd objects used for attacks (not bullets, though; anything moving too fast to be perceived with normal human senses requires a different power).
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"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.

The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index

[cheshire]

Yeah, I've let them do that by burning a FP (Force Point). They thought it was pretty awesome. Heh, they even did it to save someone's life, so they got the FP back at the end of the session.
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Before we take any of this too seriously, just remember that in the middle episode a little rubber puppet moves a spaceship with his mind.

[garhkal]

[DougRed4]

I do it as the RAW suggest, but then my players haven't abused it (we've discussed and are aware of the way one could metagame and take advantage of the system).

[Under Pale Gray Skies]

How do you guys start jedi characters in your games? In terms of force points, cont/sense/alter, and starting powers.

Thanks.

[DougRed4]

I've got a Jedi in my game, but he's proven to be sort of lackluster so far. Due to the way he was forced to have pretty lame stats (2D) in most other things to have anything decent with his Force powers, he's struggled a bit to activate things like Lightsaber Combat due to the many rolls he needs to make and the MAP kills him. He's got enough low stats that he's always the last to go in combat, too.

I'm looking at reworking Force Points (see the other thread discussing this), to potentially help him out (and keep Jedi from being too overpowering when they advance).

[Guardian_A]

Force users? I tend to lean towards stories that either have no Force users, or everyone is a Force user.

When I do have a player who wants to play a Force user with a group of non-Force users, I've always found it easiest for the player to create the character normally (But make it Force sensitive), then let the character develope the talent in-game instread of starting the character with some existing skills. This helps establish the tradition they follow, as well as allowing the player to learn how to use the powers as their character learns them. This method is especially useful for players who are either new to the game, or have never played a Force user before.

[garhkal]

In games where i allow someone to play a force user, they make them as is.
Each starting D they place into their force attributes (c/s/a) gives them 1 starting power..
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[cheshire]

Yeah, unless you're doing some sort of COMPLETELY altered Force rules, if you boost the Jedi at the beginning of the game, they'll be running the game in no time.

Also, make sure you create situations that force the Jedi to diversify their skill set. If all the do is control and sense, they'll be mowing over short range targets before you can blink.
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Before we take any of this too seriously, just remember that in the middle episode a little rubber puppet moves a spaceship with his mind.

[vanir]

We found the best compromise for Force using PCs is the Quixotic or Minor Jedi templates so only 1D is sapped from attributes.
Thing is the character background has to work into the campaign era/plot, and these work for classical era campaigning which is what we like, starting just prior to Episode IV period and moving through the Rebellion era to Endor and beyond.
Like this we can start a PC with a lightsabre as a Minor Jedi with 17D attributes, 1D Control and a Force power, with a backstory that he was a Youngling and his Master was killed, etc.
A Quixotic Jedi (1D Sense) is self taught so doesn't have a lightsabre unless you have a peculiar background, like in our current campaign we have a Sabre Rake who was a Quixotic, just took one of his attribute dice for 1D in Sense and a Force power, and sabre rakes have a lightfoil which functions like a low powered lightsabre using the same skill (during his adventures he learned lightsabre construction and rebuilt it as a full powered lightsabre using quested focus crystals and whatnot).
With those templates you don't lose too much from mundane skills/attributes whilst still beginning as a basic Jedi student.
They lag behind non Force using PCs less but have a long road of Jedi study to become recognised Jedi, at least they can still use regular skills in the meantime and keep up with the Party.

We had a Young Jedi template in the past but the 15D attributes really took a toll and for many adventures he was a useless PC that essentially just tagged along until towards the end of the campaign (the Player was very bored and frustrated), when suddenly in a single small adventure he went from having to hide behind crates to suddenly taking over the entire game having built up his Force/lightsabre skills. That's kind of the problem with regular Jedi templates, they're extremely vulnerable all the way to something like 6D in Force skills and then once they start reliably MAPing powers/actions and toss in a FP they just dominate the game and all of a sudden no non-Force using PC can hope to keep up.

The other way is to start Force Sensitive at 18D attributes and learn Jedi skills along the way, which is much more usable in early adventures as a party PC but the problem here is you must as a GM create plausible circumstances for the Player to gain Jedi training, which can impact campaign plots when say for example, the Party starts wondering why the Jedi Master the PC has found to learn from doesn't go duel Vader or otherwise become an active NPC affecting game outcomes. This takes a bit of work if you want to keep a suspension of disbelief and keep the Players focused on the campaign plot points and not fudged, blind subplots for the benefit of a PC.
There is also the issue that it takes much extra longer before they'll be proficient as a Jedi character using a variety of Force powers and building up good lightsabre combat skills. The drawback for the Player is the GM can essentially control their progression in Jedi skills through the Master NPC/Holocron, forcing them to spend CP as instructed. With a starting full Jedi PC template the Player has more control over his own progression typically.

A Young Jedi template will be less usable in early adventures but will outshine others as a Jedi PC much sooner, and be super powerful quicker.
Plus they can have little boosts like starting with some scholar: Jedi Lore and Lightsabre skills at character creation, so they really have that recognition among the other PCs as a proper Jedi where someone who takes it up along the way doesn't really until they outshine the shooters with their lightsabre, then others start regarding them as a Jedi but generally not before. "oh the MonCal, yeah he can roll a pencil with his mind and now he thinks he's a Jedi smh"

[CRMcNeill]

I'm experimenting with an alternate Force system that creates a serious paradox for Jedi.

1) I've changed Force Sensitive to an attribute, with CSA as skills under that attribute. In addition, I've rewritten and/or broadened the scope of several Force powers. This isn't always in the Jedi's favor; for instance, with Danger Sense, I've replaced the automatic initiative win with a bonus to initiative equal to the Jedi's Sense roll, counterbalanced by initiative penalties for complex, subtle, indirect and/or simultaneous attacks.

2) Using garhkal's Disturbance in the Force rule, if a Jedi rolls to high on his Force skills, he causes a disturbance in the Force that stimulates an Imperial response.

3) Most importantly, I actually penalize Jedi for excessive Force use, in the form of reduced CP awards and such.

I haven't been able to pull the whole thing together in a manner that I like, but the goal is to create a Force system in which Jedi are still very powerful, but are forced to be much more circumspect in how and when they use their abilities.
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"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.

The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index