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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010
Posts: 16326
Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
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 Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 7:14 am Post subject: |
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| garhkal wrote: | | crmcneill wrote: | | Slightly off topic, but how would a Jedi counter Force Choke / TK Kill if it is being used on someone other than the Jedi? Would the Jedi have to know the TK Kill power in order to be able to counter it? |
Unless it was being used on them directly, i don't see them being allowed to counter its use on others.. otherwise Obiwan could have 'been rescued' by Anakin (if he had it).. But in my home games i have allowed the victim himself in the same round AFTER it was applied (ie a free action but with all applicable maps still taken into account) to make an instinctive TK roll with a base 10+success over his control roll that the enemy had to try and counter it. IF he failed then he still takes the listed damage.. If succeeded, he takes damage at 1 cat less. |
In that scene, they were both being Force Choked and suspended in the air for a second or two just before Obi-wan got tossed across the room. Force Choke wasn't applied nearly long enough to need a counter.
As far as actually being able to counter TK Kill, IMO, it is a logical continuation of the concept of TK Kill itself. If a Force adept can sense the inner form and workings of another's body, and can manipulate the internal structure to cause harm, then the inverse should also be true, in that the adept can counteract harm being inflicted. For example, if Force Choke manipulates the structure of a target's airway to cut off air supply, then it should also be possible to manipulate the airway structure to force it open, maintaining air supply.
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"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
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Raven Redstar
Rear Admiral
Joined: 10 Mar 2009
Posts: 2648
Location: Salem, OR
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| Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 7:34 am Post subject: |
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| crmcneill wrote: | | I never said anything about doing Force Choke while fighting with a saber. This is strictly about whether or not a Jedi could potentially counter the effects of someone elses's Force Choke, reversing its effects. As for Luke using Force Choke in ROTJ, Im not going to argue that point, apart from saying that I think that is the obvious conclusion based on film evidence, and I have never heard an alternate explanation that makes sense. To avoid getting even further off topic than we already are, let's just leave it at that. |
I didn't say you did. I was just bringing in my own thoughts about how one might counter a force choke. The dark sider can choose to defend himself or keep the choke going, but not both. Hence, attacking the would disrupt concentration, and then would lose "grip."
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garhkal
Sovereign Protector
Joined: 17 Jul 2005
Posts: 14228
Location: Reynoldsburg, Columbus, Ohio.
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| Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 4:10 pm Post subject: |
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| crmcneill wrote: |
As far as actually being able to counter TK Kill, IMO, it is a logical continuation of the concept of TK Kill itself. If a Force adept can sense the inner form and workings of another's body, and can manipulate the internal structure to cause harm, then the inverse should also be true, in that the adept can counteract harm being inflicted. For example, if Force Choke manipulates the structure of a target's airway to cut off air supply, then it should also be possible to manipulate the airway structure to force it open, maintaining air supply. |
I don't see it as an "Obvious logical" counter. A potential counter, maybe..
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MattMartin23
Lieutenant Commander
Joined: 25 Jun 2012
Posts: 102
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| Posted: Fri Aug 03, 2012 2:53 pm Post subject: |
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| garhkal wrote: | | Ohhhh go along or watch friend die... always a good one! |
Yep, my thoughts exactly. I may or may not allow the PCs to get away. It depends on how creative they are. One thing is certain, the Dark Jedi will not die or be maimed in the conflict and the heroes will not die in the conflict. If he is injured and they escape I am fine with that. I have plans for their escape from imprisonment if they are captured. It will be epic.
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scott2978
Lieutenant Commander
Joined: 02 Jun 2005
Posts: 220
Location: Arizona, USA
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| Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2012 2:57 am Post subject: |
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Ahh the good games gone bad because I used to plan like this....
One thing I've learned over the years is not to plan to take the PCs hostage as a result of an actual battle. If you know they must be taken captive, then don't let them have another choice - just narrate them being surrounded by enemies and tell thm flat out -
"Looks like they have you surrounded, if you resist, you might take a few of them with you but you're pretty sure you'll die, and the old man depending on you for this medicine (or whatever contrivance brought the PCs here) will die too. What do you do?"
If they insist on resisting, tell them to put the dice down - they got off some good shots but get peppered with stun blasts and go unconscious. Then you can have them wake up a captive later.
Remember though this is only good advice if the PCs must be captured to set up the story. Any other time it's just railroading.
Often enough, if you try to let things play out on their own with the intent that the PCs will get captured in the end, things will not play out in such a way as to accomplish your goal, and then you have to make a decision either to start fudging dice (which the Players are likely to catch on to after two party members are down) or let all your plans go to hell.
If you know they must be captured don't give them any other choice - just narrate an ambush and move things along quickly.
Scott |
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garhkal
Sovereign Protector
Joined: 17 Jul 2005
Posts: 14228
Location: Reynoldsburg, Columbus, Ohio.
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| Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2012 4:59 pm Post subject: |
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Very true. Many a time i have seen combats go nowhere like the DM planned.. Whether it was supposed to be a waltz over by the party which ended up turning into a close TPK (prior to the DM starting to fudge to save them), or it was a hard challenge which should have brought a good number of the pcs close to death prior to their eventual win, that they waltzed through with nary a scratch.
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