Intuitive Use Of The Force

[CRMcNeill]

So I've had this idea floating around in my head for a couple weeks (thanks, atgxtg) that the RAW does not do a good job of representing the intuitive nature of the Force as it appears in the films. Obviously, some Force powers require conscious effort to use, but others appear to happen with no conscious effort. These intuitive abilities appear to be almost entirely Sense-based, and it got me thinking as to what house rules might best reflect that. For instance, what if Danger Sense was eliminated as a power, and the Jedi simply stacked his Sense dice with his Perception dice for initiative and Search rolls?

I'm getting ready to head out for a few hours, so I don't have time to think of more examples, but there are plenty of Sense powers to consider. Personally, I think the list should be limited to Sense powers only, as Control/Sense, Alter/Sense and Control/Sense/Alter powers all seem to require conscious effort.

Thoughts?
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"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.

The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index

[Bren]

I have thought for a long time now that using Sense for the initiative roll made a lot of sense after seeing TPM and all Qui Gon's comments on Jedi reflexes. However, I don't think stacking Sense with PER gives the result of knowing there is a danger present and being able to put up other powers or take appropriate action to deal with it. So there may still be a place for Danger Sense. But maybe making it all intuitive rather than a concious power may give you more of the movie effect.

I would probably substitute Sense for PER for intitiative rather than stacking. There are two reasons for this. First, just like size (i.e. STR) matters not when your ally is the force, I think that PER matters not if your Sense is good enough. Second, for game balance a Jedi youngling isn't more perceptive and doesn't have a better initiative than 4D PER Lando Calrissian.

Of course in liking the idea of swapping Sense for PER, I may be influenced by the fact that I run a Jedi with a 2D+2 PER and a 6D Sense.

[garhkal]

The big issue there is, for the init, you can eventually have someone with so high a sense, that even on force points, the highest Per race will not defeat them. And since it is much cheeper to raise sense than it is Per, that is all you will see Jedi pc raising.
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Confucious sayeth, don't wash cat while drunk!

[CRMcNeill]

[CRMcNeill]

[garhkal]

[Bren]

It would be more correct to say that "having force powers be intuitive, AND/or allowing them to substitute Sense for Perception" makes it less likely that experienced Jedi are surprised and or lose the initiative and makes it highly unlikely for very experience Jedi.

For example, if the Jedi has Sense of 6D and he is opposed by non-force user with a Perception of 4D the Jedi will usually win the intiative, but not always.

[CRMcNeill]

[garhkal]

In the revenge of the Sith we saw several HIGH ranking jedi get surprised...
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Confucious sayeth, don't wash cat while drunk!

[Bren]

[Fallon Kell]

[CRMcNeill]

[Bren]

MAPs is undoubtably a factor along with combined actions. Keep in mind that we generally see the killer Clones like Rex and Cody hanging out right next to the Jedi. Those guys are not some 4D or 5D blaster skill Clones. They are elite and very, very experienced. So when a bunch of experienced Clones all suddenly turn on the Jedi - even if you know you are in trouble you may not be able to successfully parry. Plus, just because your allies are now trying to kill you it doesn't mean that the battle droids have suddenly stopped targeting you either.

[garhkal]

Lets see.. we saw Ki-admundi get shot at just as his troops levelled their weapons at him.. iirc he deflected a few shots..
That chick got taken out before she could even react. The only one who seemed to get ahead of the game was Yoda.
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Confucious sayeth, don't wash cat while drunk!

[Naaman]

This is one of the reasons I allow perception based skills to oppose sense based force powers.

Danger Sense, in my mind, is only explicable as a passive power. Ki Adi Mundi may very well have succeeded on his sense roll to detect danger from the clones, but stormtroopers (presumably clones), can combine fire without needing a command roll (not sure if this made it into 2nd edition... but we still use it). Also, as Bren mentioned in another thread, the movie submits to drama before it submits to the D6 RAW.

You also have to remember, as Bren also said, in explaining why a special forces operator would be a 12D NPC with his highest skill at 3D+2, that characters other than Yoda, Mace, Luke Anakin etc are just supporting the story. They were made to be destroyed/killed/defeated etc. The two Jedi who accompanied Mace Windu served only one purpose from a dramatic stand point: to demonstrate the difference in prowess between Palpatine and a "regular" Jedi master.

Obi Wan, for example, is nowhere near Yoda's level in Ep 2, yet his danger sense kicks off just fine in the bar. We also know that he lags in experience at this point behind Ki Adi Mundi, who was on the council in Ep 1.

The PCs are meant to be the equivalent of Obi-Wan, Anakin, Han Solo, Luke, etc for their own particular story arc. So it seems logical that they would surpass the minor characters who get splatted all over the arena by battle droids or surprised by clones etc.