Dark Campaign

[ender5000]

I am about to start a game with four players. 2 of them want to be dark side characters and the other two want to be generally evil. I really don't want an evil campaign and I don't want dark side force users running around. I blame it on our goody-two-shoes exalted D&D campaign we've been doing for three months where I'm a player.

This is my first time to GM Star Wars, and I'm not sure how to proceed. The book says that when a character is overtaken by the dark side that the GM takes the character. Well, they obviously don't want that. But I don't want to tell them they can't play what they want, that wouldn't be fun for them, and that should be the point.

Any thoughts / resources for dark side character campaigns?

[KageRyu]

Hmm, a few thoughts on both sides. I'll adress the Dark Side sources first.

There are a few Fan Made supplements in existance that have alternate rules for the Dark Side and how it acts. You might want to check out The Jedi Handbook, and Galaxy Guide 14 - The Dark Side, also the Tales of the Jedi Companion, and the orriginal 2nd Edition Rulebook (Blue Cover, not Revised & Expanded) had some rules for how the dark side affects characters (The rulebook specifically made mention of allowing Dark Side characters, but this was removed in R&E).
If you were to run a Dark Side campaign, simply suspend the normal rules for a character being handed over (or reverse it, if the character is "Redeemed" he becomes handed over). There are also several discussions in the forums, especially under house rules and official rules, that may help too.

Now, on how you feel about the issues.
Remember, you are the GM. You go through a lot of effort to create and set up the game to entertain your friends, and they should apreciate this. You could explain to them that you feel a Dark Side campaign is not in the feel of Star Wars as you see it, and you would prefer not to run it. Suggest that if they wish to play evil characters, they do so in one of the other campaigns the group runs, as you believe Star Wars is about the good guys. I can certainly understand not wanting to make the game unfun for the players, but from experience I can say, if the GM isn't having fun, neither are the players. Try to reach a compromise.
Though, the alure of playing dark Jedi is fun, you as the GM know in the end, the Dark Jedi are doomed to lose.
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"There's a set way to gain new Force Points and it represents a very nice system, where you're rewarded for heroism, not for being a poor conductor to electricity." ~Jachra

[Hellcat]

Well, one thing I can think of is the DSPs. Whenever a character gets a DSP you're supposed to roll 1D. If the result is less than the their total number of DSPs then they fall to the dark side. If their starting out as dark siders, then there is no need to roll to see if the fall whenever they get a DSP. But if they lose a DSP, then roll 1D. If the roll is greater than their total number of DSPs, then there is a chance that they may be redeeming themselves. Roll 1D again and if the result this time is less than their total number of DSPs, they must then do something heroic in their next two battles and can't do anything that could earn them any DSPs until after those two battles are over.

Also, depending on what era you play in, you could have a few Jedi you could constantly keep hounding the PCs, looking to bring them to justice.

Another thing you could try is suggesting they play Imperial characters instead of dark siders or evil characters. Heroes and Rogues will help you with that.

Edit: Something I just realized after just posting in another thread. Try checking page 152 of the second edition, revised and expanded as there are rules there for players playing a dark side character.
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[Akari]

My humble suggestion: If you are not 100% certain you want to run a campaign because of the characters and general player attitude: Don't. It can only go badly eventually and nobody will have fun.

Please dont let yourself be pressured into something you don't want to GM.

[KageRyu]

[ender5000]

Thanks for the help guys, I think I'm going to talk to them before we even start which will be good. I think they be sufficiently 'bad' by being Imperials or bloodthirsty rogues on no side in the war. I can do that. Also, given the timeframe I was planning (1 year after Yavin) the only dark force users are Vader and the Emporer, and they aren't going to be trained by them anytime soon.

[Chandra Mindarass]

Don't forget that the dark side is not even equally strong. It is only strong as long as it remains undiscovered and can attack from behind. It is a shadow, that cannot exist without the light, that casts it. The dark side will try to gain more and more from the characters, until their action sicken even them. Dark side careers are usually very short and constructed from lies and cheating yourself. If you're a good GM, the players will stumble upon that themselves and if you're a mean GM, then the dark side will not simply let them go.
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RPGGamer (featuring a big portion of DLOS-stats!)

>-q=p---

[ender5000]

I broke it to my dark-force wannabe guy. He was cool with it, after whining a little. Instead he made a assassin droid. Check over in the adventures forum, I posted how it went there. Everyone had fun and they can't wait for next week, that's what's important right?

[Trusty]

Star Wars is Star Wars. I see no reason to make them Imperials to be evil, nor do I think you should be bummed about it. I mean come on, you can have fun with it. What NPC can you make is gonna fear the Dark Lords of 1D Contrrol, Sense, and Alter?

I like the reversing thing with the DSPs. Let them try to be "reasonable" sometimes...and thus making them redeemable. They will get mad at you for taking them away, but if they are gonna be evil, they have to be just that. There are consequences for good Jedi to do bad things, likewise, there are consequences for dark jedi to do good things.

But make it hard on them. While you are more flexible, and it is more fun when the crew are independents (all our campaigns, the characters are independent), I'd make them hated by everyone (evil hates other evil in the end, and good hates it also...so); instead of them making any friends with any/all of them like independents normally do. They'll eventually get bored. Good-natured independents are more flexible than dark-siders. They have less room with different emotions. Not only do they have to do evil, they have to think evil. If they aren't consumed with lying, cheating, jealousy, power-hungray, biterness...even with each other...they lose DSPs and risk becoming redeemable.

Just my $0.02 Being good all the time is hard; being evil all the time is harder and more mundane.

[Jedi Skyler]

I know it's been a while since anyone posted here, but I wanted to post this for anyone else with players wanting to run DJs. Along the reversal idea, instead of giving them DSPs, give them LSPs. The more they get, the more trouble they have using the dark side. Stuff like that. Make it so their consciences start bothering them.

[Endwyn]

I always found the easiest way to run a dark campaign was to approach it from one of two angles, either change nothing in the story arcs, and let them change the adventure's outcomes to fit their own darker wants, or to build the reverse plots. Use your story arcs as the good guy's counter moves that the bnad guys have to manuever around.
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Luke, I am your father.
That's impossible!
And Leia is your sister!
That's improbable?
And the Empire will be destroyed by..EWOKS!
That's...highly unlikely.
The Force? Bacteria called midichlorians.
If you don’t take this seriously I'm out.

[Vanion]

Personally, I either try to talk the players out of evil SW campaigns or I simply say "no".

D&D is really different. Generally speaking, a D&D campaign is going to be dark and gritty with many different tpes of dangers for both evil and good characters... a Displacer Beast really isn't going to stop to ask if you are good or evil and dungeon traps are going to be equally unbiased. I've ran a few evil D&D groups and they are just as challenged as the good characters. The only diference is the style of play and the choices that the characters take to deal with the problem.

On the other hand, Star Wars is a stage set for heroes and heroic deeds against overwhelming odds. Evil has it's grib on the galaxy... the forces of good are on the ropes... to me, the game loses some of it's best qualities when the characters have the power of the Emperor, Vader, and the Empire at their backs... even if those elements are not actively assisting the characters. Only during the Old Republic do we see evil as the underdogs... and even that comment can be debated. I know that some people play "alternate universe" SW games, such as... "What would the galaxy be like if Vader had not turned". Maybe in one of those two examples, I'd let the group play evil characters without much feet-dragging on my part.

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[Jedi Skyler]

I normally wouldn't allow evil characters either. It just does seem to go against the normal ambience of the way the universe is designed... Although going against the grain is sometimes fun!

I knew a guy who went through a D&D campaign with a full party of evil paladins. Imagine all the ruckus they caused!

[Endwyn]

The one evil D&D game I played in had more group co-operation, teamwork, and cordination than any "good" game we ever played. It was ironic.
_________________
Luke, I am your father.
That's impossible!
And Leia is your sister!
That's improbable?
And the Empire will be destroyed by..EWOKS!
That's...highly unlikely.
The Force? Bacteria called midichlorians.
If you don’t take this seriously I'm out.

[Jedi Skyler]

Good thing it was just a game!