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Volar the Healer
Jedi
Joined: 04 Aug 2003
Posts: 664
Location: Arizona, USA
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 Posted: Mon Jul 11, 2005 2:16 pm Post subject: |
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| KageRyu wrote: | | I guess people are just more comfortable being dictated to? |
I've wondered about this myself, sometimes. When teaching new players, I notice their biggest problem is they have no imagination. I guess they're used to following a script in a computer RPG and have no idea what to do with "If you could visit Coruscant, where would you go?" or other open ended questions.
Albert Einstein said "Imagination is more important than knowledge." I often tell my students: "A great scientist is not judged by what he knows; He's judged by the questions he asks."
The difference between WEG's D6 or (WOtC's pitiful) d20 doesn't matter if your "players" can't think.
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KageRyu
Commodore
Joined: 06 Jul 2005
Posts: 1391
Location: Lost in the cracks
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 5:08 am Post subject: |
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| Volar the Healer wrote: | | The difference between WEG's D6 or (WOtC's pitiful) d20 doesn't matter if your "players" can't think. |
I would agree, except the biggest justification I hear as to why WotC D20 is better is because the "classes" are more well defined, with an obvious line of progression and clear advancement from level ups. Personally, that linearness to D20 based systems (D&D/Palladium) was one of the reasons I started drifting away from them. I wanted to go "Beyond what's defined". That, and the longer I had the same group play, the more I heard questions lik, "Why can't my warrior learn magic?" or "Why can't a wizard wield a sword? What about the proficiency system?". It became clear to me that "because the rules disallow it" just isn't a good answer, even though it's to maintain game balance.
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Argamoth
Lieutenant Commander
Joined: 06 Jul 2005
Posts: 234
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 9:38 am Post subject: |
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| d20 also seems to be a lot more ability oriented. Wizards and co. get spells, Barbarians and Rangers get combat abilities, Rogues get more abilities and skills, etc. d6 is more skill driven, so classes don't exist at all, and you can mix and match however you want. |
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Volar the Healer
Jedi
Joined: 04 Aug 2003
Posts: 664
Location: Arizona, USA
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 10:49 am Post subject: |
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d20 works for medieval settings when people were lucky to have one useful skill, but it just doesn't work for a game based in a technological setting.
For example: I am a retired US Marine (with all that entails) who now works in radiation protection at a laboratory assisting in fusion research. I have also played first string violin in an orchestra and stood in as a minister. My other skills include Karate, carpentry, motorcycling, and war gaming (to name a few).
So what character class am I?
I run two D&D campaigns (2nd edition), but my Star Wars must be D6. I have no use for the current d20 system.
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Volar the Healer
Jedi
Joined: 04 Aug 2003
Posts: 664
Location: Arizona, USA
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 10:55 am Post subject: |
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| KageRyu wrote: | | Why can't my warrior learn magic? |
Aragorn, and many other fantasy warriors did.
| KageRyu wrote: | | Why can't a wizard wield a sword? |
Gandalf, and many other fantasy wizards did.
| KageRyu wrote: | | It became clear to me that "because the rules disallow it" just isn't a good answer... |
I agree.
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Argamoth
Lieutenant Commander
Joined: 06 Jul 2005
Posts: 234
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 8:04 pm Post subject: |
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| d6 can work for medeivil-fantasy settings too. You just have to tweak things for magic. |
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Warhippo
Ensign
Joined: 14 Jun 2005
Posts: 30
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| Posted: Wed Jul 13, 2005 3:17 am Post subject: |
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Personally I dislike class based systems. The cool thing about D6 is that although it has character templates, you can dispense with them so easily alloing you to create a far more lifelike character.
The D20 system tends to put a stranglehold on creativity rather than embracing the possibilities of freedom.
Hey ho, each to their own. The cool thing about the whole WotC rise to fame is that it has rekindled the RPG scene, even though it's through a fairly shoddy line-up. Ironic really, kind of like the fast food / pop music company of the RPG industry.
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KageRyu
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Joined: 06 Jul 2005
Posts: 1391
Location: Lost in the cracks
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| Posted: Wed Jul 13, 2005 7:42 am Post subject: |
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WotC is the Mikey-D's of Role Playing 
PC:"I'll play a McWizard, with a McMagic Missile."
GM:"Would you like fries with that?"
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Phalanks Balas
Lieutenant Commander
Joined: 05 Jul 2005
Posts: 176
Location: Paris - France
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| Posted: Wed Jul 13, 2005 8:15 am Post subject: |
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Templates are good for newbie players. I prefer to choose all the skills of my caracter. When I present it for the first time to other players, I never say " Hi I'm Phalanks the bounty hunter". I just descibe what other caracters can see : what is worn, race tall etc... There isn't neon light above my caracter showing "it's a bounty hunter"  Other players will know what I can do during the aventure
Have you never been shot by a studient in geology ?
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Phalanks
A day you will be facing the guns of the Black Pearl. You will know what means damned pirates ! |
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Kehlin Yew
Lieutenant Commander
Joined: 07 Jun 2005
Posts: 223
Location: America
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| Posted: Wed Jul 13, 2005 9:53 am Post subject: |
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Aren't there only like 8 classes for Wizards D20 system?... i dont like that...
they dont even have the template for the class i am in d6... i started as a smuggler on my first adventure, yes... but now that guy is a merc.
another character is a cleaner...
if wizards want to be even close to what Weg put out... they need to set down an completely redefine the game... |
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Argamoth
Lieutenant Commander
Joined: 06 Jul 2005
Posts: 234
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| Posted: Wed Jul 13, 2005 11:28 pm Post subject: |
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And when only one person in the group owns the books, it's a lot easier to bend the rules.
d6 also cleans up a bunch of special abilites that appear in D&D. Personaly, I think spell resistance is a cheap way to make monsters more powerful.. |
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Hellcat
Grand Moff
Joined: 29 Jul 2004
Posts: 11921
Location: New England
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| Posted: Thu Jul 14, 2005 2:35 am Post subject: |
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| Kehlin Yew wrote: | Aren't there only like 8 classes for Wizards D20 system?... i dont like that...
they dont even have the template for the class i am in d6... i started as a smuggler on my first adventure, yes... but now that guy is a merc.
another character is a cleaner...
if wizards want to be even close to what Weg put out... they need to set down an completely redefine the game... |
Oh, didn't you know? You're supposed to pick a template that best fits the D6 character  . I much prefer the D6 style where the templates are more just a point for starting off and the character can either stay with the template or they can change entirely. You could start off as a smuggler but get enough training that if the character joined the rebellion they could then become a fighter pilot. Or their training could lead to them becoming a merc or a bounty hunter or anything else. Everytime I look at the D6 to D20 conversions on WotC's website, it looks like you start in one template and remain there, just advancing levels within the template.
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Jedi Knight Jael Weiss
Ensign
Joined: 07 Dec 2003
Posts: 33
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| Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2005 11:05 pm Post subject: |
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Holy Cow!
I am out of the loop for a year, and when I get back, my post has over ten pages!
It's enough to make me cry for joy!
Jael...
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