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ooryl2
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Joined: 30 Mar 2011
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 Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 1:15 pm Post subject: Force Skills and Intro. Adv. Game Question |
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Hi 
Please excuse any ignorance here. My family and I just started or first foray into the world of SW d6. We've never done any pen and paper RPG's before. We started out with the Introductory Adventure Game box. I actually tried this out back in the late 90s with a few friends when I was in high school, but we didn't get too into it then, so I still had the box laying around. My family and I had fun with the first mini-adventure, the escape from Edan base, although it will take us a bit to get into the whole actually roleplaying the characters I think.
Anywho, there were a few questions we had about the character templates with the I.A.G. box.
My step-daughter decided to play as the Young Jedi. In creating the character, when adding the 7D worth of skills to the template, can she add dice to the Force Skills, increasing any of the 3 to 2D or 3D? If so, then would she select more Force Powers to start with?
It seems like without doing so, it would be a while before being able to use any of the basic Powers, as most seemed to require at least a roll of 10 to be used. Although, I'm guessing that CP can be used to increase the amount of dice for the Power check.
Secondly, if we like the game after finishing the adventures in the I.A.G. box, I plan on picking up the Revised and Expanded rule book as well as some of the other adventure books. I know there's different character templates in the R&E book, and the skills are expanded upon. Are the templates from the I.A.G. box ok to continue on with in future adventures, or would we be better off starting new characters with the other templates?
Thanks much! |
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Bren
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| Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 1:33 pm Post subject: Re: Force Skills and Intro. Adv. Game Question |
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Welcome to the forum and the world of Star Wars D6. This is the place to gain knowledge, share, and discuss. I don't have the IAG so my answers are based on extrapolation and the Second Edition (2E) and the Second Edition Revised and Expanded rule books (RAE).
| ooryl2 wrote: | | ...My family and I had fun with the first mini-adventure, the escape from Edan base, although it will take us a bit to get into the whole actually roleplaying the characters I think. |
It helps to give that time and be pretty easy on new players. Remind them of how the characters act in the movies. That is generally how their characters should act too.
| Quote: | | My step-daughter decided to play as the Young Jedi. In creating the character, when adding the 7D worth of skills to the template, can she add dice to the Force Skills, increasing any of the 3 to 2D or 3D? If so, then would she select more Force Powers to start with? |
Yes. She gets one power for the first D and if her background explanation allows for her being trained or for some other reason she would understand the Force well, she might have 3 powers for each D above the first. So 3D = 1+3+3 = 7 powers. Remember that some powers require more than one skill and according to the Rules as Written (RAW) that uses 1 power per skill (so learning Affect Mind uses one Control, one Sense, and one Alter power out of her 7 powers).
| Quote: | | It seems like without doing so, it would be a while before being able to use any of the basic Powers, as most seemed to require at least a roll of 10 to be used. Although, I'm guessing that CP can be used to increase the amount of dice for the Power check. |
Correct. The rules were designed to simulate the lower number of Jedi and consequent lower power of Jedi in the Original Trilogy (OT). You are also correct that beginnning Jedi often need to use CPs or the Force to be able to do much of anything force wise. They start out weak, but eventually (if they live and do not turn) they can become quite powerful. But as they become powerful they are also likely to be hunted by agents of the Emperor.
| Quote: | | Secondly, if we like the game after finishing the adventures in the I.A.G. box, I plan on picking up the Revised and Expanded rule book as well as some of the other adventure books. I know there's different character templates in the R&E book, and the skills are expanded upon. Are the templates from the I.A.G. box ok to continue on with in future adventures, or would we be better off starting new characters with the other templates? |
If the players like the characters they have created. Keep them. It is possible they may want to create new characters to try a different template or character personality. Which is also OK.
You are welcome. And again. Welcome! |
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Ankhanu
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Joined: 13 Oct 2006
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| Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 1:42 pm Post subject: Re: Force Skills and Intro. Adv. Game Question |
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| ooryl2 wrote: | | My family and I just started or first foray into the world of SW d6. We've never done any pen and paper RPG's before. |
First off, welcome, and this is awesome. I love that you're playing with your family
| ooryl2 wrote: | My step-daughter decided to play as the Young Jedi. In creating the character, when adding the 7D worth of skills to the template, can she add dice to the Force Skills, increasing any of the 3 to 2D or 3D? If so, then would she select more Force Powers to start with?
It seems like without doing so, it would be a while before being able to use any of the basic Powers, as most seemed to require at least a roll of 10 to be used. Although, I'm guessing that CP can be used to increase the amount of dice for the Power check. |
This isn't really covered in the official rules... but, I tend to allow it. The first 1D of each Force Skill has to come from Attribute dice, but I allow Skill Dice to be used to increase them above 1D (and I impose a limit of 3D on the Skills). Like you said, without this, it takes a REALLY long time for Jedi to be the least bit useful; especially with starting players, it's important for them to feel useful at the beginning or it may turn them off the game. For more experienced players, that level of "I can't do anything" can be a fun challenge, but for newbies, it's a turn off.
I generally also allow more Force Powers along with the increased allocation of dice into the Skills, up to 1/pip allocated, depending on the background. If they've not had a teacher, I might not allow extra Powers, or might allow a reduced number. If they've had a teacher, there's no reason to limit them unless it is desired for the story.
| ooryl2 wrote: | Secondly, if we like the game after finishing the adventures in the I.A.G. box, I plan on picking up the Revised and Expanded rule book as well as some of the other adventure books. I know there's different character templates in the R&E book, and the skills are expanded upon. Are the templates from the I.A.G. box ok to continue on with in future adventures, or would we be better off starting new characters with the other templates?
Thanks much! |
Yeah, they're fine. Templates are just to give you ideas, you don't need to use them at all. As long as the Attribute and Skill dice & selections total up right and match what you want the character to be, you're all good.
After you get the idea of how the game works, you might want to abandon templates altogether... but, the templates in any of the books are generally compatible without "upgrade".
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ooryl2
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Joined: 30 Mar 2011
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| Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 3:09 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks for the responses I'll let her know that info and see if she wants to edit around a few skill points before we start the next adventure.
May even surprise her with a little R2 unit of her own like the RAE Young Jedi template has. Then my Protocol Droid character would have some company  I'm doing the GM stuff, but have a Protocol Droid character with the group. I don't partake in any group choices since I know the story, and they decide what the droid will do. He was Edan Base's quartermaster droid (like Emtrey was for Rogue Squadron), so he's the group's bargainer. But really he's just an in-character way I can give them advice on what to do. |
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Bren
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| Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 3:19 pm Post subject: |
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| ooryl2 wrote: | Thanks for the responses I'll let her know that info and see if she wants to edit around a few skill points before we start the next adventure.
May even surprise her with a little R2 unit of her own like the RAE Young Jedi template has. Then my Protocol Droid character would have some company I'm doing the GM stuff, but have a Protocol Droid character with the group. I don't partake in any group choices since I know the story, and they decide what the droid will do. He was Edan Base's quartermaster droid (like Emtrey was for Rogue Squadron), so he's the group's bargainer. But really he's just an in-character way I can give them advice on what to do. |
Your welcome.
An in character way of giving information is a good thing and based what we see of 3P0 it's not like a protocol droid is the character the party should look to for good decisions. 
Two thoughts:
(1) You might consider that rather than giving her Young Jedi a droid you make getting the R2 part of another adventure. People often value more what they earn. Possibly the party has to repair the droid or rescue him from danger or a bad master.
(2) If the droid belonged to the Young Jedi all along, you might consider making the droid tie into the Jedi's background. I have a brash young Jedi PC who has an R2 that originally belonged to the PC's father (who he never met). The droid has not been wiped since before the PC was born and thus knows things about the Jedi PC's background that he himself did not know. Like what his father looked like. |
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ooryl2
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| Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 3:22 pm Post subject: |
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| Bren wrote: |
Two thoughts:
(1) You might consider that rather than giving her Young Jedi a droid you make getting the R2 part of another adventure. Possibly the party has to repair the droid or rescue him from danger or a bad master.
(2) If the droid belonged to the Young Jedi all along, you might consider making the droid tie into the Jedi's background. I have a brash young Jedi PC who has an R2 that originally belonged to the PC's father (who he never met). The droid has not been wiped since before the PC was born and thus knows things about the Jedi PC's background that he himself did not know. Like what his father looked like. |
Great ideas! I'll have to look into those. I did suggest one of the characters put some of their initial 7D into droid programing/repair in case the Protocol Droid had a little mishap and got himself damaged. Might work that into the group finding a little R2 along the way. |
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ooryl2
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| Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 4:56 pm Post subject: |
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| Oh, and would the Protocol Droid get to use Force Points to double their dice too? My first thought would be no, but haven't seen anything in the rule book that says either way. |
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CRMcNeill
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| Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 4:59 pm Post subject: |
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| ooryl2 wrote: | | Oh, and would the Protocol Droid get to use Force Points to double their dice too? My first thought would be no, but haven't seen anything in the rule book that says either way. |
Per the 2R&E Rulebook, droids may spend CPs and FPs as normal; they just can't be Force Sensitive or learn any Force skills or powers.
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Bren
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| Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 5:07 pm Post subject: |
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| ooryl2 wrote: | | Oh, and would the Protocol Droid get to use Force Points to double their dice too? My first thought would be no, but haven't seen anything in the rule book that says either way. |
If you are treating the protocol droid as an NPC you might want to not give him/her/it any Force Points. If the PCs are the only ones to have FPs then it is easier for them to end up the heroes. I would give the protocol droid some CPs (though less than the PCs get). This is how my GM treats my brash young Jedi's astromech droid. Tooey CPs but no Force Points.
If the protocol droid is effectively a PC, then crmcneill stated the RAW correctly. Though there are a number of GMs who don't give droids force points despite the rules. |
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garhkal
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| Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 5:16 pm Post subject: |
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Going through the 2nd ed R&E book, the only time you gain more powers when increasing your force stats, is in Improvement (spending CP).. So i think that in cha creation, you do NOT gain more force powers for putting any of your 7d into the force skills.
| Quote: | | Secondly, if we like the game after finishing the adventures in the I.A.G. box, I plan on picking up the Revised and Expanded rule book as well as some of the other adventure books. I know there's different character templates in the R&E book, and the skills are expanded upon. Are the templates from the I.A.G. box ok to continue on with in future adventures, or would we be better off starting new characters with the other templates? |
They should be compatible. Each template should have 18D of attributes, 7d of skills, dark side point tracker, wound tracker, equipment list, personality, history, connection to other characters, force point tally, a tick box for whether force sensitive or not, and a character point tally on it.
| Quote: | | Per the 2R&E Rulebook, droids may spend CPs and FPs as normal; they just can't be Force Sensitive or learn any Force skills or powers. |
Thats PC droids, though.
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CRMcNeill
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| Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 5:18 pm Post subject: |
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| Bren wrote: | | If the protocol droid is effectively a PC, then crmcneill stated the RAW correctly. Though there are a number of GMs who don't give droids force points despite the rules. |
The best explanation I have heard to this is that FPs and CPs are expressions of the Force as a whole and the character's place in it, as well as their importance to the story. While a droid may not be present in the Force (as detectable by a Jedi) that doesn't prevent their actions from being guided by the Force as a whole.
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"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index
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ooryl2
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| Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 5:24 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks for the info
I think we'll run him as a PC protocol droid (if the group gets an astromech, it'll be an npc) and have the FP available just in case. Doubt it will have to be used, but I'd rather them have it and not need it, than need it and not have it. |
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Fallon Kell
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| Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 8:38 pm Post subject: |
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Welcome to the rancor pit! I started out as a player on Edan II, back in the mid 90s and still remember it fondly. I hope your family enjoys it as much as I did!
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garhkal
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| Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 11:31 pm Post subject: |
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But how will he as a droid gain more? I have never understood how (with uploading their programming/saving it, the could 'truely die' ergo how could they be considered doing something heroic that places them at risk>??
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CRMcNeill
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| Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 11:46 pm Post subject: |
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| garhkal wrote: | | But how will he as a droid gain more? I have never understood how (with uploading their programming/saving it, the could 'truely die' ergo how could they be considered doing something heroic that places them at risk>?? |
I would argue that, with droids at the higher end of sophistication (specifically the ones capable of achieving sentience and being playable as characters), the identity program running in their heuristic processor has become so complex that it can't be easily copied if the droid is destroyed, barring exceptional circumstances like Blue Max saving Bollux's personality after he was shot by Uul-Rha-Shan.
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"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index
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