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Inquisitor1138
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Joined: 28 Nov 2021
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Location: Hoth. Or Ilum...
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 Posted: Wed Nov 09, 2022 1:40 am Post subject: MRX-BR Pacifier, Request For Information |
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Sadly, i do not appear to have the MRX-BR Pacifier in my books & PDFs, and i hope the Rancor Pit community can help me with a few details. *Correction; i found it in Starships Stats R&E censored.
Source: Galaxy Guide 8 – Scouts (page 42), Lords of the Expanse: Gamemaster Guide (page 42), Galaxy Guide 6: Tramp Freighters, Second Edition
Are the stats 100% the same between the different books? Are there stats in other WEG materials?
Space: 7
Atmosphere: 600; 1200 km/h?????
C:\Users\Sam\Documents\Star Wars\D6 & D20 RPG\Speed Chart - D6Holocron.htm
http://d6holocron.com/wiki/index.php/Speed_Chart_Draft_2.X.4
http://d6holocron.com/wiki/index.php/Expanded_Speed_Chart
Space: 7 Atmosphere: 350; 1,000 km/h
Space: 8 Atmosphere: 365; 1,050 km/h
Space: 9 Atmosphere: 400; 1,150 km/h
Space: 10 Atmosphere: 415; 1,200 km/h
Hardly the first time the fine folks at WEG dropped the ball & punted the hamster.
These gaffs do make me more forgiving of fan creations were the numbers seem pulled out of Otherspace or crazy...
I may just make 4 models/generations of the MRX-BR & call it a day.
Info?
Thoughts? |
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garhkal
Sovereign Protector
Joined: 17 Jul 2005
Posts: 14228
Location: Reynoldsburg, Columbus, Ohio.
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| Posted: Wed Nov 09, 2022 1:56 am Post subject: |
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The main copy i have is via scouts.. There its listed as space 7, atmosphere 600/1200kph.
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Confucious sayeth, don't wash cat while drunk! |
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Inquisitor1138
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Joined: 28 Nov 2021
Posts: 612
Location: Hoth. Or Ilum...
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| Posted: Wed Nov 09, 2022 3:06 am Post subject: |
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| garhkal wrote: | | The main copy i have is via scouts.. There its listed as space 7, atmosphere 600/1200kph. |
Thanks, G! |
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Dr. Bidlo
Commander
Joined: 24 Nov 2021
Posts: 440
Location: Arizona, USA
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| Posted: Wed Nov 09, 2022 9:30 am Post subject: |
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| I thought it was intentional to show the Pacifier was faster in space than in atmosphere. I kind of like that idea, buy I guess it was a mistake. |
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fogger1138
Lieutenant Commander
Joined: 25 Feb 2021
Posts: 104
Location: Maine
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| Posted: Wed Nov 09, 2022 10:27 am Post subject: |
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| Dr. Bidlo wrote: | | I thought it was intentional to show the Pacifier was faster in space than in atmosphere. I kind of like that idea, buy I guess it was a mistake. |
Yeah, whenever there's a discrepancy I've always gone with this idea rather than immediately assume it's a screw-up. |
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Inquisitor1138
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| Posted: Wed Nov 09, 2022 1:04 pm Post subject: |
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| Dr. Bidlo wrote: | | I thought it was intentional to show the Pacifier was faster in space than in atmosphere. I kind of like that idea, buy I guess it was a mistake. |
You mean faster in atmosphere than in space, right? That is what these stats show. Which from a real world physics pov doesn't make sense, whereas a ship being slower in atmosphere than in space would make sense, because of atmospheric drag. |
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Dr. Bidlo
Commander
Joined: 24 Nov 2021
Posts: 440
Location: Arizona, USA
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| Posted: Wed Nov 09, 2022 1:17 pm Post subject: |
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| Inquisitor1138 wrote: | | Dr. Bidlo wrote: | | I thought it was intentional to show the Pacifier was faster in space than in atmosphere. I kind of like that idea, buy I guess it was a mistake. |
You mean faster in atmosphere than in space, right? That is what these stats show. Which from a real world physics pov doesn't make sense, whereas a ship being slower in atmosphere than in space would make sense, because of atmospheric drag. |
I must have had the two transposed - it was faster Atmosphere than Space.
As to the physics of differential atmospheric speeds with drag versus a vacuum with no resistance - combined with imaginary technology - I cannot speak. If I can believe a person can shoot lightning from his fingers, I can be sold that a ship could be faster in atmosphere than in space. |
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Inquisitor1138
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Joined: 28 Nov 2021
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Location: Hoth. Or Ilum...
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| Posted: Wed Nov 09, 2022 1:55 pm Post subject: |
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| Dr. Bidlo wrote: | | Inquisitor1138 wrote: | | Dr. Bidlo wrote: | | I thought it was intentional to show the Pacifier was faster in space than in atmosphere. I kind of like that idea, buy I guess it was a mistake. |
You mean faster in atmosphere than in space, right? That is what these stats show. Which from a real world physics pov doesn't make sense, whereas a ship being slower in atmosphere than in space would make sense, because of atmospheric drag. |
I must have had the two transposed - it was faster Atmosphere than Space.
As to the physics of differential atmospheric speeds with drag versus a vacuum with no resistance - combined with imaginary technology - I cannot speak. If I can believe a person can shoot lightning from his fingers, I can be sold that a ship could be faster in atmosphere than in space. |
For me to buy that i'd at least need some kind of explanation to sell it; "It uses an ancient Rakata Force-powered something something to blah blah blah..." |
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Whill
Dark Lord of the Jedi (Owner/Admin)
Joined: 14 Apr 2008
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Location: Columbus, Ohio, USA, Earth, The Solar System, The Milky Way Galaxy
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Inquisitor1138
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Joined: 28 Nov 2021
Posts: 612
Location: Hoth. Or Ilum...
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| Posted: Wed Nov 09, 2022 9:23 pm Post subject: |
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| Whill wrote: |  |
Sorry, Supreme Chancellor, Sir. I'm just a simple engineer making my way in a space magic galaxy of chaos & war... |
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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010
Posts: 16326
Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
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| Posted: Wed Nov 09, 2022 9:51 pm Post subject: |
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600; 1,200 km/h is almost certainly a typo. Per the official WEG conversion formulas in the Blue Vader book, 1,200 km/h would have a Move of 415 (or "415; 1,200 km/h" in proper notation). That makes it as fast as a TIE Fighter in atmosphere, but it's far from the only ship to have different speeds in that fashion. I've used it deliberately to flesh out background information for several of my home stats. In fact, that's exactly what I did on my stat re-write of the Pacifier.
_________________
"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index
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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010
Posts: 16326
Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
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| Posted: Wed Nov 09, 2022 9:55 pm Post subject: |
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| Whill wrote: | |
Always nice to see one of my memes get play.
_________________
"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index
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Inquisitor1138
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Joined: 28 Nov 2021
Posts: 612
Location: Hoth. Or Ilum...
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| Posted: Thu Nov 10, 2022 1:44 am Post subject: |
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| CRMcNeill wrote: | | 600; 1,200 km/h is almost certainly a typo. Per the official WEG conversion formulas in the Blue Vader book, 1,200 km/h would have a Move of 415 (or "415; 1,200 km/h" in proper notation). That makes it as fast as a TIE Fighter in atmosphere, but it's far from the only ship to have different speeds in that fashion. I've used it deliberately to flesh out background information for several of my home stats. In fact, that's exactly what I did on my stat re-write of the Pacifier. |
| CRMcNeill wrote: | g, here's your request. As far as the cockpit. I'm thinking the design would make more sense if the "double nose" section of the cockpit was inverted, so that it stuck out, instead of in. That way, the cockpit window would look like it was wrapping around the top of the nose section, rather than trying to bend into a double-sided cockpit.
MRX-BR Pacifier
Craft: Sydon Vehicle Works' MRX-BR Pacifier
Type: Armed Scout Ship
Scale: Starship (+6D)
Length: 25 meters
Skill: Starship Piloting: MRX-BR Pacifier
Crew: 1
Crew Skill:
Astrogation 4D
Gunnery 5D
Piloting 5D
Sensors 4D
Shields 4D
Passengers: 3
Cargo Capacity: 25 metric tons
Consumables: 1 year
Hyperdrive Multiplier: x1
Hyperdrive Backup: x8
Nav Computer: Yes
Maneuverability: 1D
Space: 7 (3D+2)
Atmosphere: 415; 1,200 kph (5D)
Hull: 3D+2
Shields: 2D
Sensors:
Passive 30/1D
Scan 60/2D
Search 120/3D
Focus 10/3D+2
Weapons:
3 Laser Cannon
Fire Arc: 1 Front/Left, 1 Front/Right, 1 Rear/Left/Right
Skill: Starship Gunnery
Fire Control: 3D
Range:
--Space: 1-3/12/25
--Orbital: 2km-6km/24km/50km
--Atmosphere: 100m-300m/1.2km/2.5km
Damage: 4D
Note: Because the Pacifier is designed to be operated by minimal crew, all three cannon are controlled from a remote firing station in the cockpit. In addition, weapons firing in the same fire arc automatically fire-link, generating a +1D bonus that can be applied to either Fire Control or Damage.
2 Warhead Launchers
Fire Arc: 1 Front, 1 Rear
Skill: Starship Gunnery
Rate of Fire: 1
All Other Stats vary by Weapon Type
Capacity: 16 rounds (central magazine feeds both launchers). May select any Weapons from this list, as well as Gravity Bombs or Space Mines from this list (Rear Launcher only), depending on Availability.
House Rule Notes:SHIELD & SHIELD CONTROL: 2D @ 1D
VELOCITY MODIFIER: 2D+2 Flight (2D Space) |
*squints*
??
Why the incongruity of "Space: 7 (3D+2)
Atmosphere: 415; 1,200 kph (5D)"?
I was surprised both by you keeping it, and not giving any explanation as to why.
I would have expected maybe adding afterburners or a turbo boost or even a 'Super Pursuit Mode'. Something.
Every time i came across a ship entry that is so blatantly an error (or outright lazy writing), i have rectified it either by favoring one stat over the other & correcting the disfavored stat, or by having different models whereby the design improved over time.
Presently, i am thinking of having the Model A & Model B in service before the Clone Wars, with Space: 7 Atmosphere: 350; 1,000 kmh & Space: 8 Atmosphere: 365; 1,050 kmh respectively. The line was about to be canceled/terminated due to abysmal sales, but the Clone Wars changed everything, with the Jedi Order & the GAR scooping them up at steep discounts. With demand for more rising due to its new role as an Aggressive Reconnaissance Craft, loved by Jedi, ARC Troopers & Clone Commandoes alike, new models were ordered & sales boomed.
Supreme Chancellor "I am the Bank" Palpatine sold War Bonds to cover the costs of ordering the new models in bulk.
The Models C & D having Space: 9 Atmosphere: 400; 1,150 kmh & Space: 10 Atmosphere: 415; 1,200 kmh respectively.
Then there's the second error i found in the RAW stats:
Crew: 1
Passengers: 3
should be
Crew: 1, gunners: 4
Passengers: 0
which i will use as the standard for Models A & B. For the Models C & D
Crew: 1, gunners: 4
Passengers: 3
as a dedicated Special Operations ARC vessel. The vast improvement so impressed military commanders, they requisitioned them in record-setting numbers. Even f Admiral Tarkin ordered them by the dozens for SpecOps...
I think the GAR Models definitely used CRMcNeill's revised & expanded Starship-Scale ordnance list...
By the end of the Clone Wars, most of the older models were refitted to the Model D's specs.
Last edited by Inquisitor1138 on Thu Nov 10, 2022 2:17 am; edited 2 times in total |
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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010
Posts: 16326
Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
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| Posted: Thu Nov 10, 2022 1:52 am Post subject: |
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When I did those stats, I was updating just the stats, not the background fluff (in many cases, I used the fluff to justify changes to the stats). I didn't bother to explain it in several other ships, including the Z-95 Headhunter (which, per the RAW, had an Atmosphere more appropriate to a ship with a Space of 9). Generally, the explanation will be that the ship was equipped with augmented repulsorlifts or some other such technobabble to explain it, with the main reason for retention being an added layer of granularity in ship stats.
I came up with a solution for the crew/gunner problem, as well.
_________________
"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index
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Inquisitor1138
Captain
Joined: 28 Nov 2021
Posts: 612
Location: Hoth. Or Ilum...
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| Posted: Thu Nov 10, 2022 2:25 am Post subject: |
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| CRMcNeill wrote: | | When I did those stats, I was updating just the stats, not the background fluff (in many cases, I used the fluff to justify changes to the stats). I didn't bother to explain it in several other ships, including the Z-95 Headhunter (which, per the RAW, had an Atmosphere more appropriate to a ship with a Space of 9). Generally, the explanation will be that the ship was equipped with augmented repulsorlifts or some other such technobabble to explain it, with the main reason for retention being an added layer of granularity in ship stats. |
"I Hate sand..."
| CRMcNeill wrote: | | I came up with a solution for the crew/gunner problem, as well. |
One gunner for both Proton Torpedo Launchers & One gunner for each Laser in the RAW in GG8: Scouts is in the Weapons' description/stats; the only problem i had was not listing the 4 Gunners. |
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