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MrNexx
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 Posted: Thu Oct 21, 2021 11:21 am Post subject: You are on this council... |
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Ok, this is a specific peeve of mine. Since it's been coming up in memes recently, I figured I'd grumble about it.
Why put Anakin on the Council, but not make him a Master? Wouldn't it make sense to do the absolute opposite?
"Ok, we're going to recognize your skill and service, but we're not going to give you a say in the general governance of the Order" makes sense to me. "You get the rank, but we don't want you in charge." Sure, it's a bit of a snub, but Anakin wouldn't necessarily want to be on the Council anyway... he's out fighting the war. You could even PHRASE it so it's not a snub. "We are recognizing you as a Master, but your role as general is so important that we are not burdening you with a Council position at this time." Boom. We're promoting you, we're saying you're special, but we're keeping you out of the leadership of the Jedi.
They went, instead, with "We're going to have you help us lead, but we're going to specifically insult you by not giving you the promotion you earned."
Arrrrgggghhhh.
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CRMcNeill
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| Posted: Thu Oct 21, 2021 12:50 pm Post subject: |
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It's been a while since I read the Revenge of the Sith novelization, but it's worth looking at in/re this. It gives insight into the thought processes of the various characters about why they made the decisions they did.
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MrNexx
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| Posted: Thu Oct 21, 2021 1:07 pm Post subject: |
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| CRMcNeill wrote: | | It's been a while since I read the Revenge of the Sith novelization, but it's worth looking at in/re this. It gives insight into the thought processes of the various characters about why they made the decisions they did. |
I'll have to check it out, then.
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garhkal
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| Posted: Thu Oct 21, 2021 3:03 pm Post subject: |
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Being that iirc his putting on the council, was specifically a move Palpaltine made, NOT the council, i think it was fitting they recognized his status on the council, in Deference to the chancelor, NOT his status as a master..
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CRMcNeill
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| Posted: Thu Oct 21, 2021 3:28 pm Post subject: |
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Theory: denying Anakin the rank of master was a test to see if he truly was ready to be a master. The council had to have at least an idea of Anakin's personality and temperament, so they devised a test tailored for him in that moment. And he failed the test. If he had accepted the obvious snub with some degree of grace - as opposed to being pouty, entitled and complaining about how unfair it was - they might've acted differently.
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garhkal
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| Posted: Thu Oct 21, 2021 4:25 pm Post subject: |
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That matches with what we saw from mace towards anakin..
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ThrorII
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| Posted: Thu Oct 21, 2021 6:59 pm Post subject: |
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The council chooses their own members. Anakin was placed on the council as the Chancellor's representative, not as a 'normal' council member. It is my belief that the council could have denied the Chancellor's request for a rep on the council. They accepted it because they thought they could use Anakin to spy on Palpatine.
It was fitting that he was not granted the rank of master. He had not trained anyone yet, nor was he elevated by the Jedi Council itself.
Palpatine knew this, and knew of Anakin's ambitions. He knew placing Anakin on the council in this fashion would widen the rift between Anakin and the Jedi.
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Whill
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| Posted: Thu Oct 21, 2021 11:22 pm Post subject: Re: You are on this council... |
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| MrNexx wrote: | Ok, this is a specific peeve of mine. Since it's been coming up in memes recently, I figured I'd grumble about it.
Why put Anakin on the Council, but not make him a Master? Wouldn't it make sense to do the absolute opposite?
"Ok, we're going to recognize your skill and service, but we're not going to give you a say in the general governance of the Order" makes sense to me. "You get the rank, but we don't want you in charge." Sure, it's a bit of a snub, but Anakin wouldn't necessarily want to be on the Council anyway... he's out fighting the war. You could even PHRASE it so it's not a snub. "We are recognizing you as a Master, but your role as general is so important that we are not burdening you with a Council position at this time." Boom. We're promoting you, we're saying you're special, but we're keeping you out of the leadership of the Jedi.
They went, instead, with "We're going to have you help us lead, but we're going to specifically insult you by not giving you the promotion you earned."
Arrrrgggghhhh. |
Yes, as garhkal and ThrorII point out, you are forgetting a major plot point of the film (no novelization needed for this). The High Council did not put Anakin on the High Council. Palpatine appointed him there as his personal representative to the council, which the council only begrudgingly accepted. Anakin wasn't promoted to master because he wasn't master material (he was an iffy knight as it was). Palpatine knew the council wouldn't make him a master, and that it would frustrate Anakin. Palpatine also knew they would ask Anakin to spy on his mentor, which would also frustrate Anakin. It was all part of Palpatine's manipulations to make Anakin feel the Jedi were keeping secrets from him and plotting against Palpatine, so Anakin would betray the Jedi and be a principle instrument of the revenge of the Sith. In the end, the plan worked nearly perfectly (except for Yoda, Obi-Wan, and Anakin's offspring surviving, and Vader being cyborgified).
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MrNexx
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| Posted: Fri Oct 22, 2021 12:12 pm Post subject: |
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Ahh, I did forget that. Makes a lot more sense.
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