View previous topic :: View next topic |
Author |
Message |
CRMcNeill Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010 Posts: 16326 Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
|
Posted: Thu Oct 18, 2018 12:46 am Post subject: Underwater Energy Weapons |
|
|
Whill's work on the Deepwater-Class Light Freighter has gotten me thinking about high-tech weapon options for underwater vessels. Per Battle for the Golden Sun, blaster weapons are at reduced effectiveness underwater, and the projectile alternatives (torpedoes and spear guns) are little different conceptually from the real world versions of the same weapons.
So, I started wondering if there would be any sorts of high-tech weaponry that would actually be more effective underwater. Sonic weapons certainly would, but would likely prove difficult to focus narrowly enough for point attacks.
The other option that occured to me was a linear-discharge tractor beam-type weapon, using tractor tech to "push" a column of water into a target at high velocity (enough to do kinetic damage). A variation on that would be an extremely narrow-angle tractor beam - literally a kinetic energy beam - could be weaponized to inflict penetrating damage on a target.
I just wanted to get this in writing before I packed it in for the night. Let me know what you think. _________________ "No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
Pel Line Captain
Joined: 10 May 2006 Posts: 983 Location: Texas
|
Posted: Thu Oct 18, 2018 2:59 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Blasters would encounter problems, as you mentioned, but you might try a retuned laser beam. Blue-green lasers tend to penetrate further into seawater than other colored beams, mimicking the properties of visible light. It's why everything looks blue underwater. We played around with this a bit years ago and found the blue-green works best in RL applications.
I like your tractor beam idea. Squib Tensor Rifles might be effective also. _________________ Aha! |
|
Back to top |
|
|
garhkal Sovereign Protector
Joined: 17 Jul 2005 Posts: 14228 Location: Reynoldsburg, Columbus, Ohio.
|
Posted: Thu Oct 18, 2018 3:03 pm Post subject: |
|
|
What of concussion weapons? Like the Concussion rifles, used in the Dark forces games.. _________________ Confucious sayeth, don't wash cat while drunk! |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Raven Redstar Rear Admiral
Joined: 10 Mar 2009 Posts: 2648 Location: Salem, OR
|
Posted: Thu Oct 18, 2018 3:26 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Deleted my last post, apparently the Concussion Rifles were a form of Sonic Weapon. It's likely that they would cause way more collateral damage underwater.
https://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Concussion_rifle _________________ RR
________________________________________________________________ |
|
Back to top |
|
|
CRMcNeill Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010 Posts: 16326 Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
|
Posted: Fri Oct 19, 2018 12:46 am Post subject: |
|
|
garhkal wrote: | What of concussion weapons? Like the Concussion rifles, used in the Dark forces games.. |
I'd want to know way more about the physics of exactly how Concussion Rifles do what they do.
Raven Redstar wrote: | Deleted my last post, apparently the Concussion Rifles were a form of Sonic Weapon. It's likely that they would cause way more collateral damage underwater. |
There's also the fact that, when fired in atmosphere, the bolt maintains cohesion until it strikes a solid object, at which point it has a blast effect. But water doesn't compress like air does, so there's a good chance the bolt would expend its energy as soon as it leaves the barrel... _________________ "No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
Naaman Vice Admiral
Joined: 29 Jul 2011 Posts: 3190
|
Posted: Fri Oct 19, 2018 11:38 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I'm a bit skeptical that water could be used to deal kinetic damage in the way you're suggesting. According to my understanding, you would need some kind of way to isolate the weaponized water if you wanted to achieve a hydraulic effect (which is what you seem to be getting at?).
Using the tractor beam tech to create a vacuum, however, might allow a pressure differential that rips a target apart, rather than puncturing it.
Last edited by Naaman on Sat Oct 20, 2018 12:37 am; edited 1 time in total |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Whill Dark Lord of the Jedi (Owner/Admin)
Joined: 14 Apr 2008 Posts: 10447 Location: Columbus, Ohio, USA, Earth, The Solar System, The Milky Way Galaxy
|
Posted: Sat Oct 20, 2018 12:35 am Post subject: Re: Underwater Energy Weapons |
|
|
CRMcNeill wrote: | The other option that occured to me was a linear-discharge tractor beam-type weapon, using tractor tech to "push" a column of water into a target at high velocity (enough to do kinetic damage). A variation on that would be an extremely narrow-angle tractor beam - literally a kinetic energy beam - could be weaponized to inflict penetrating damage on a target. |
It makes the most sense to me that "repulsor" tech pushes, and "tractor" tech pulls, because that's what those words actually mean. Just sayin'. _________________ *
Site Map
Forum Guidelines
Registration/Log-In Help
The Rancor Pit Library
Star Wars D6 Damage |
|
Back to top |
|
|
CRMcNeill Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010 Posts: 16326 Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
|
Posted: Sat Oct 20, 2018 12:53 am Post subject: |
|
|
I tend to agree, but "tractor" is the in-universe term for manipulating kinetic energy at a distance. I'm simply using it for the sake of familiarity, in that whatever tech drives tractor beams could be inverted to "push" hard enough to inflict damage. If this theory of tractor technology is correct, tractor tech could be linked to concussion weapons and the seismic charges from AotC.
Repulsors would be a good fit, except that in the SWU, repulsor refers to anti-gravity tech, with repulsors "pushing" against the local gravity field, and not the ground underneath the vehicle. Some repulsorlift vehicles (particularly landspeeders) would use tractor-tech fields to "grab" the ground under them to generate movement, but that would be two separate technologies: one neutralizing gravity, the other "pulling" on the ground. _________________ "No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
CRMcNeill Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010 Posts: 16326 Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
|
Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2018 1:21 am Post subject: |
|
|
I had a thought here based on a PM conversation with Whill.
A weapon that exists in official stats (barely: it's included on exactly three out of all the official WEG stats) is the Pulse Laser. However, Pulse Lasers are indistinguishable stats-wise from regular Laser Cannon, so they pretty much just exist because a stat writer thought they sounded cool.
What I'm thinking is that Pulse Lasers could be re-worked to be laser cannons specifically tuned to function underwater, reducing or negating the penalties to blaster weapons listed in Battle for the Golden Sun. All that would be required from there is re-naming the weaponry on the three ships that already have pulse weapons...
An initial thought on the techno-babble would be that the individual pulses create a pocket of super-heated steam in their wake, which eases the passage of the next pulse, which in turn eases the passage of the next bolt and so on and so forth.
A first draft on the differences between standard Lasers and Pulse Lasers:Pro:
-When fired underwater, a Pulse Laser only loses 1D of Damage (instead of 2D) and hits at normal Difficulty (regular Lasers suffer a +5 Difficulty at all Ranges)
Con:
-Pulse Lasers are bulkier and more expensive, due to the specialized equipment and tuning needed to generate the pulse effect. Double weight and cost for Laser Weapons (as listed in Tramp Freighters); installation and repair costs unchanged. _________________ "No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
CRMcNeill Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010 Posts: 16326 Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
|
Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2018 2:44 am Post subject: |
|
|
Pel wrote: | I like your tractor beam idea. Squib Tensor Rifles might be effective also. |
I've heard a couple different variants; the Tensor Rifle was one, but the other was a tractor beam variant - called a Force Cannon - that oscillated between "push" and "pull" thousands of times per second and essentially ripped the target apart at the molecular level. _________________ "No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
Pel Line Captain
Joined: 10 May 2006 Posts: 983 Location: Texas
|
Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2018 11:57 am Post subject: |
|
|
That would work both in and out of water. I'm also intrigued by Namaan's vacuum idea. Cavitation releases a tremendous amount of energy (which is why it makes so much noise and can be heard miles away) so if you could localize the effect it's a potentially potent weapon. _________________ Aha! |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Zarn Force Spirit
Joined: 17 Jun 2014 Posts: 698
|
Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2018 2:04 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Gree or Aing-Tii technology might utilize some form of non-locality principle to cause explosions or energy bursts at any given coordinate.
Supercavitating projectiles might be the underwater equivalent of railguns.
A multi-beam attack might cross several beams at a given point in order to intensify the effect of the beams. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
CRMcNeill Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010 Posts: 16326 Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
|
Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2018 2:29 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Zarn wrote: | Gree or Aing-Tii technology might utilize some form of non-locality principle to cause explosions or energy bursts at any given coordinate. |
Interesting, but that sounds more like a niche exotic weapon than something mainstream that's commonly found aboard underwater platforms.
Quote: | Supercavitating projectiles might be the underwater equivalent of railguns. |
How would this help, exactly? I was picturing something similar to a bowcaster, with projectiles encased in zero-friction energy sheaths to ease their passage through the water. Would cavitation have a similar effect?
Quote: | A multi-beam attack might cross several beams at a given point in order to intensify the effect of the beams. |
Or maybe a combined beam ala the composite beam projectors in AotC, combining their firepower to reduce degradation from passage through the water? _________________ "No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
Pel Line Captain
Joined: 10 May 2006 Posts: 983 Location: Texas
|
Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2018 10:15 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Yes, super-cavitation enables high-speed movement through water. The Russians supposedly have some supersonic torpedoes that operate on this principle. _________________ Aha! |
|
Back to top |
|
|
CRMcNeill Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010 Posts: 16326 Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
|
Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2018 10:30 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Pel wrote: | Yes, super-cavitation enables high-speed movement through water. The Russians supposedly have some supersonic torpedoes that operate on this principle. |
Cool. I think I may apply that principle to sub-torpedoes to justify high speeds underwater. _________________ "No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
|