working on simpler force skill use rules

[hotdogs_stuff]

as the title suggests i have been working on new rules for force use. rules that would be dynamically different than the original 1e or 2e rules but would be fully compatible with them. i shared this in a mewe group back in march and didn't get much input, but with covid keeping gatherings to a minimum and me having so many projects around my house i haven't had time to get everything finished. i guess i am looking for feedback and maybe someone to collaborate with.
I love playing d6 star wars, but the force rules are disproportionally complex when compared to the rules for the rest of the game. My thought process was to group the "powers" into skill trees (putting like powers in the same box of the tree), and then using points and prerequisites to unlock other branches/boxes. you'd still use the same 3 force skills (control, sense and alter) with the same mix for special powers, but instead of 3 rolls for situations you'd just need a certain amount of dice in the less relevant skills and just roll the one more pertinent ability. for instance a skill requiring a difficult "control and sense" roll and an alter save vs targets perception would look like this: requires 6d control and 6d sense and then the user must beat the targets perception with a roll of their alter skill. or something like that. i will try to attach a picture of my control template idea. i also have sense done as well, but i have to go through alter and all the mixed powers. notice that many items just give an ability bonus or additional abilities.
control+idea by hotdog stuff, on Flickr

[Xain Arke]

Hey hotdogs_stuff

Interesting ideas

The table itself does look a little the FFG Star Wars Force power trees, not saying that is good or bad, just reminds me of those. Inspiration or just similar thought?

One main thing I would suggest is replace the term Parkor. I get what you are going for, but to me it's a little to 'now' a word for Star Wars. Your other titles are
great, so maybe try to find another word for that one.

It's a little difficult from what you've posted so far to give a fair opinion on the system stuff yet, but I would say try to keep it as simple as possible, I know from
experience just how easy it is to make these kind of rules more complex than the one you were trying to replace

Though I don't personally find the existing D6 Force rules complex, I kind of like what you are doing here and I'm curious to see where you go with it.

[Whill]

hotdogs_stuff, thanks for sharing your ideas here. Welcome to the Pit!
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[Raven Redstar]

Jedi Movement or Acrobatics might be a good name instead of Parkour.
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[Xain Arke]

[hotdogs_stuff]

thanks for the critique and willingness to give input. sorry i couldn't get back earlier but i am so busy at home it's hard to find goof off time.

the inspiration for the skill trees actually came from video games i was playing with my wife (or watching her play) like war in the north and assassins creed (amongst others). making the skills as as easy to use as video games was always on my mind, but i never messed with it until march of this year.

i did also like the way the trees were organized in the FFG books (i don't play FFG but i have bought several of the books to use as sourcebooks for d6 adventures). the clunky d6 force rules caused me to buy not only both editions of west end games role playing game (as well as their re-up counterparts) but also the d20 game and the saga edition d20 game (which were maybe even more clunky), star wars legion, x-wing and imperial assault but none were as simple to use as just plain old d6 (minus the force).

the reason i wanted the overhaul was because the last campaign i ran (which ended about 18 months ago) had a female jedi character in it. she kept trying to do jedi mind tricks or telekinesis or cool things ezra bridger could do in season 1-2 of rebels- but she would constantly fail because the multiple actions required or seemingly disproportioned difficulty numbers.

I realize 1e is pretty basic, and if you stick to that alone things can go pretty smooth; but my pcs like to do stuff they see in the star wars media. i thought the lightsaber combat rules were pretty bad too. rolling to be able to add some dice to another skill so you could roll again was pretty lame. I thought that if you had a talent tree, something light lightsaber combat (depending on your skill level) would just allow you to parry with your sense skill, or allow you to add your control skill to your damage- no rolls needed. that way you can save your rolls for fun stuff.
I have some of the skills rewritten, i used "rebugs" prerequisite flow chart to maintain that aspect of the game (putting the prerequisites at the beginning of the flow chart). i used the force powers sourcebook i downloaded from here (the rancor pit) to group the skills into tighter groups (and i can see how parkor might sound lame compared to accelerated movement/or advanced movement- but it's not completely fleshed out- which is why i appreciate the help).
here's another "control" work in progress flow chart i was refining. the control description may give you a better idea of what i had in mind. i wanted boxes the PC could check and know what they could do in a turn (for parkor it was things like - level 1 add 1.5 to your max movement, jumping and gain some ability to move up vertical surfaces (with a difficulty roll based on the situation). level 2 burst of speed powers and up the walls type abilities, and level 3 the enhanced attribute type power.

control part 2 by hotdog stuff, on Flickr

[Mamatried]

My "easy to use" force rules are as follows.

All forceusers know ALL force powers.
with 1 force skill, like Alter they can however only manifest Alter powers.
However they when they have 4D in the dominant force skill activate any Alter+ type skill
like Control Another's pain which Alter+Control.
However control counts as 1D for any rolls and can NOT be raised by spending cp or force powers.
it is the force allowing the use in the first place.

He always uses his Highest Force skill Dice value for all checks to activate a force power,
however if he activates a force power using more than one force skill, his effects are determined by the lowest skill dice

You can spend a force point to -Flip- This, using the lowest skill to activate and the highest roll for effect/Damage

Darth Iwantobe Asithtoo

Alter: 4D
Control: 2D
Sense : 3D

-Examaple with Force Lightning (Alter/Control Power)
He rolls 4D (Alter) on his checks to use the skill
He rolls 3D (Control) on his damage/effect roll

Rolls his Alter checks with Alter (4D)
Deals damage on Alter powers with Alter (4D)

Rolls Control/Sense checks with Control
Deals Damage/Effect with Sense

(same with alter/Control)

Rolls his Alter/Control/Sense Checks with Alter (4D)
Effect/Damage by Sense (2D)

Even though the force user as access to all powers, he still needs to refine the use and manifistation of his favored forces.
much like a scorcerers' spells pr day and wizard's spell prepared.

A jedi can focus on mastering certain powers. he lists these under "Powers mastered" and he can manifest these
normally like above

However a jedi that has NOT mastered in Lightsaber Combat will still activate the skill using his highest dice, though at a -1D
penalty, and his effect skill is always 1D
Wild dice counts normally on these rolls.


-Darth Iwantobe Asithtoo-

These are the powers Darth Iwantobe Asithtoo have masterd: Force Lightning, lightsaber combat, inflict pain, telekinesis, inkure/kill

he decides to try telekinetic kill, being a rea true darth vader fanboy and want ot be awesomely scary too
he rolls 4D for his alter to use the power, but since he has not mastered this, he must remove 1D
He rolls 3D to activate the skill, he succeeds and inflicts 1D in potential damage.
the Senator rolling his very average 2D for 8 for his resisting, and the up and evil comming Darth Iwantobe Asithtoo
rolls 6(wild dice) and then rolls 1 for a total of 7.
Even when trying to be scary and using his jealous hatred and the darkside he still have a bit to learn
Darth Iwantobe Asithtoo, soon figures out that he is still not as powerful as the much more darly awesome Darth Vader

He then remembers he can use a force point, he now rolls 1D to activate the skill, obviously not succeeding unless he is a very wild dicy and explosive mood........

so there is how you limit the use, and why force pints are more powerful
as the character grows.

once the vader fanboy have mastered his idol's hobby power, he can spend his force point/darkside point and be allowed to roll 2D to activate the skill
but for a 4D in effect, and since he used a force point his wild dice explodes

[hotdogs_stuff]

[Raven Redstar]

I wrote up a single roll force system which is hosted on the library:
https://www.rancorpit.com/forums/downloads/Other%20Fan-Made%20Supplements/Force%20Power%20&%20Description%20-%20Raven%20Redstar.pdf

It's designed to bring the Force more in line with the way all other Attributes and Skills are designed. After trying to teach D6 to several new players who all struggled with the massive multiple action penalties and confusion that came from learning Force Skills as well as the early uselessness of Force Trained characters, I thought this was a good first step. It needs a little editing and I still need to convert over dark side powers to the system, but it gives you a basic idea.

Force Powers have been categorized into single skills: Control, Sense, Alter. I have a list at the beginning of the document. For skills that were multiple rolls, they've been allocated to a single skill now with a small bump in difficulty. I've used the system in solo plays and was going to start using it in my home games, but I haven't been able to get my group going due to long days at work.

Hopefully this helps, maybe it'll inspire you for some of your own work.
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[pakman]