Are Stuns Cumulative?

[dph]

Is the Die Penalty from multiple Stuns cumulative?
(I am not referring to the number of stuns you can receive before falling unconscious, only the die penalty for receiving a stun in the current and subsequent round)

We have always played it that multiple stuns are cumulative.
A Wookie with 5D strength who is stunned three times in the same round is at -3D (in addition to MAPs and other Wound penalties) for that and the following round.

This of course gets complicated when one receives stuns over multiple rounds and each one starts and finishes at different times.
Round One
The character is stunned. -1D (standard stun damage)
Round Two
The character is stunned again. -2D (from the cumulative current and last stun)
Round Three
The character is not hit again. -1D (The first Stun wears off but the second is still in effect.

However... I have been rereading the RAW (below) and no where does it say that Stuns are cumulative. That is, sustaining multiple stuns over the course of a number of rounds will change how long you are penalized but the penalty remains -1D. This might possibly be supported by the fact that in the case of 'Wounds', it specifically discusses wounded once and twice as being different states.

Have we been doing this wrong... for decades!
How do you all do this?
This is a game changer for my group, if we've been doing it wrong... It will make combat and keeping track of die penalties a lot easier!

RAW:
"Stunned characters suffer a penalty of -ID to skill and attribute rolls for the rest of the round and for the next round. A stun no longer penalizes a character after the second round..."
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[Naaman]

It's a little more complicated than that. The penalty is -1D for having the wound status of "stunned."

No matter how many times you sustain a "stun," you are still just "stunned" (so, -1D for two rounds).

If you sustain an additional stun, then that penalty sticks around until after the second round following the most recent stun. In the example you give, the character would have a penalty of -1D for a total of three rounds (it would never reach -2D, by RAW).

However, the "stunned" condition lasts 1 minute. Stuns accumulated in that amount of time must be tracked because when a character has accumulated a number of stuns equal to the number of D he has in strength, he falls unconscious.

For what its worth, my group tracks wound status incorrectly as well, and we've been at it since 96. For us, "heroic" characters can get "wounded twice" and we count that as adding to the threshold for more serious wound levels (so, "killed" is achieved when the NPC rolls +24 over the soak roll, for example, rather than +16 over).

[MrNexx]

As said, Stuns don't accumulate in penalties, just for the purposes of getting knocked out.
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[garhkal]

From what's said on page 97

[Naaman]

Sounds funky:
A character who get's wounded or even wounded twice, is better off for the druation of that combat than one who does a much better job soaking the damage and gets stunned three times. (with a -3D penalty, you're that much more likely to fail a dodge or parry roll, and then keep taking damage, etc). It's counter intuitive, IMO, but... maybe that's how the Buckeyes like to do things....?

[Bren]

[dph]

I think this can be read either way- we certainly did (more than 20 players over 20 years including a few rules lawyers!)... which is why I'm asking the question, but... Reading it now, and listening to the community, I agree that it's not cumulative.

This kind of thing happens a lot with any game but it's fascinating when it's a core rule like this. We've played this way for 20 years... and interestingly, it's never been a problem. Yes it DOES mean 3 stuns is worse than 2 wounds (though not many people can sustain 3 stuns anyway) but they DO go away. For us it's like that moment in a movie where the character goes down to a big hit but gets up again moments later and fights on. As it effects NPCs as well as PCs it's always been balanced... but such a pain to keep track of!

HOWEVER... I think from my rereading it, and the community sentiment, that the penalty is not cumulative... and my players will be very excited!

Thanks all!
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[dph]

[griff]

I would say that the effect is cumulative in the sense that the multiple stuns happen in the round in which a penalty is in effect. Round one character is stunned. - 1D for that round and the next. Round two character is stunned again. - 2D for this round and - 1D for the next, since the effect from the first stun has faded. If stunned twice in the same round - 2D for that round and the next. If stunned again in the next round, - 3D this round and then - 1D for the next.
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[Whill]

[garhkal]

[Naaman]

Because the stun penalty carries through your next turn. If stuns were cumulative, it becomes, IMO, far too easy to "stun a character to death" with puny weapons.

From a game balance perspective, it makes no sense to me that achieving multiple stuns on a target should be a competitive alternative to actually wounding the target.

In all honesty, I feel that -1D is even to great a penalty, since a wounded character suffers the same penalty. I feel like the penalty should be -1 or -2, but that is a separate discussion.

In any case, I'd say throw the rules out if they dont work for you and play however you find it fun to.

[Bren]

[garhkal]

Well, this boils right back to how easy it is to STUN opponents out cause of how Weg ruled stun can be done at all ranges and just needs to beat the soak roll by 5 or more..
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[Bren]