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Armor improvements.
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garhkal
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PostPosted: Sun May 22, 2016 1:44 am    Post subject: Armor improvements. Reply with quote

When using the item modification rules to give armor improvements to its Phys or Energy rating bonuses to soaking damage, does that also give a coorsponding dexterity penalty once it hits +1d energy or more)??
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Naaman
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PostPosted: Sun May 22, 2016 3:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Since we're in the house rules section, I take it you're not concerned with what the RAW says?

If so, I would tend to think that an improvement to the armor is strictly that: an improvement, and not a trade-off. The character already spent the time and money (and whatever else) to acquire the armor. Then, they have invested time and character points into their Armor Repair skill, and finally, have invested time and money into the improvements to the armor itself.

I would rule that armor could be easily modified to have upgraded protection while increasing the dex penalty (using the basic Technical attribute, even); however, with a reasonable armor repair skill roll (per RAW), any successful modification does not impose any kind of trade-off.

In other words, any Joe Blow from down the street can fasten/bolt/duct tape more padding or plating onto a piece of armor, thereby increasing its protection, but also making it heavier and more cumbersome, especially since it was not designed that way. The character is essentially wearing mobile/portable cover.

But a proper armor modification using the armor repair skill (and at the appropriate difficulty with appropriate parts paid for, etc, etc...) should be able to get the benefits without additional penalty.

My $0.02.
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Raven Redstar
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PostPosted: Sun May 22, 2016 6:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My sentiments follow Naaman's pretty closely.
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MrNexx
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PostPosted: Sun May 22, 2016 9:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would say that a modification that included a tradeoff would be easier to make, or that a tradeoff penalty might happen on a mishap, but would not inflict a penalty due to a successful modification.
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Volar the Healer
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 15, 2016 6:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I always gave a -1 dex for each +1 damage gained. This just seems to make sense to me. One cannot add mass/weight without a penalty. This also gives an excuse for more CPs to be spent removing this penalty.
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MrNexx
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 15, 2016 11:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Volar the Healer wrote:
I always gave a -1 dex for each +1 damage gained. This just seems to make sense to me. One cannot add mass/weight without a penalty. This also gives an excuse for more CPs to be spent removing this penalty.


So, if I'm modding my Blast Jacket (+1D Physical, +1 Energy), and want to add +2 to Energy, I get a -2 to Dex checks... but I can spend more to get rid of the Dex penalty?

And, I'll reiterate, spending CPs to improve equipment doesn't make any sense to me.
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Hyfigh
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 15, 2016 5:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would run it so that a normal skill check for the modification would provide a penalty. Using (A) *X Armor Engineering* would allow for that to be avoided since the character would have significant enough knowledge to avoid the pitfalls of Joe Blow's duct tape special.
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Naaman
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 15, 2016 6:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Volar the Healer wrote:
I always gave a -1 dex for each +1 damage gained. This just seems to make sense to me. One cannot add mass/weight without a penalty. This also gives an excuse for more CPs to be spent removing this penalty.


Improving the protection does not necessarily mean adding mass/weight. Sometimes, materials can be swapped from something cheap but available to something rare and expensive that is also lighter. Iron vs steel, for example... and then there are other alloys that have even different properties that make them lighter/stronger, such as steel vs chromoly, etc.
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garhkal
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 18, 2016 11:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MrNexx wrote:
Volar the Healer wrote:
I always gave a -1 dex for each +1 damage gained. This just seems to make sense to me. One cannot add mass/weight without a penalty. This also gives an excuse for more CPs to be spent removing this penalty.


So, if I'm modding my Blast Jacket (+1D Physical, +1 Energy), and want to add +2 to Energy, I get a -2 to Dex checks... but I can spend more to get rid of the Dex penalty?

And, I'll reiterate, spending CPs to improve equipment doesn't make any sense to me.


You are not spending the CP on the armor itself, but on YOURSELF learning to how to move in THAT Suit.. which is why it doesn't cross to other suits you acquire even if of the same type.
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MrNexx
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2016 12:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

garhkal wrote:
MrNexx wrote:
Volar the Healer wrote:
I always gave a -1 dex for each +1 damage gained. This just seems to make sense to me. One cannot add mass/weight without a penalty. This also gives an excuse for more CPs to be spent removing this penalty.


So, if I'm modding my Blast Jacket (+1D Physical, +1 Energy), and want to add +2 to Energy, I get a -2 to Dex checks... but I can spend more to get rid of the Dex penalty?

And, I'll reiterate, spending CPs to improve equipment doesn't make any sense to me.


You are not spending the CP on the armor itself, but on YOURSELF learning to how to move in THAT Suit.. which is why it doesn't cross to other suits you acquire even if of the same type.


So, an uber-specialization of a skill that doesn't exist?
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garhkal
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2016 1:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In essence.. yes.
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Volar the Healer
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 12, 2016 1:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It seems a simpler mechanic than creating a new skill of "wearing armour". Which, in reality, is a skill that must be trained and maintained if you're going to wear armour.

But, the game mechanic is based upon an old 1st edition rule, and reasonably replicates my experience of wearing armour - both modern and medieval.
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Volar the Healer
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 12, 2016 1:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Naaman wrote:
Improving the protection does not necessarily mean adding mass/weight. Sometimes, materials can be swapped from something cheap but available to something rare and expensive that is also lighter. Iron vs steel, for example... and then there are other alloys that have even different properties that make them lighter/stronger, such as steel vs chromoly, etc.


True. But having worn armour in my military career spanning two decades, I know no one who would trust their life to untested materials. I also know no one who has the skills,materials,laboratory set up, and desire to perform such testing.

If you have a materials engineer in your game, cool. Being Star Wars, there may be some rare unubtainium material that could be acquired at great expense and maybe after and adventure or two. But, it must be rare or hard to machine, because if it's not, why aren't others using it?

You have a good idea; my rule is just an attempt to maintain game balance; to avoid game inflation. There ain't no such thing as a free lunch.
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