Golan Space Defense Stations, problem with turbolaser ranges

[Pathwalker]

In both The Last Command Sourcebook and The Far Orbit Project it lists the weapons ranges for the turbolaser batteries of Golan Space Defense Platforms as 1-5/10/17. Does anyone else see a problem with this? Those are the ranges for a starfighter's blasters! For a "stationary" space platform (i.e. one that cannot move around much besides a bit of manoeuvering) that essentially means that a starfighter with a range out to 25 with laser cannons can sit just out of range of the Golan and slowly blow it to bits without the Platform being able to retaliate! I can only think that this was a typo that got carried over... Any thoughts?

[CRMcNeill]

Just one more WEG screw-up, really. Golans are supposed to be tough enough to take on Imperial Star Destroyers, but with the stats as written, all an ISD has to do is sit outside of the Golan's turbolaser range and pound on it. We here have come across plenty of other errors that WEG has made, and the simplest fix is, if you don't like something, change it so that it works for you. In this case, I'd just swap out the given range for the standard ranges given for turbolasers on capital ships (3-15/35/75, IIRC).

Welcome to the Pit, BTW.
_________________
"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.

The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index

[Guardian_A]

I've always just trippled the range on Golan station.

[CRMcNeill]

The proton torpedo launchers on the Golans have Starfighter ranges as well. They should be up in the 60 max range, ala the Concussion Missile Launchers on VSD II's and SSDs.
_________________
"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.

The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index

[garhkal]

Add another vote to they were improperly wrote in. IMO they should be FURTHER than the range of comparable SDs cause the platforms can push more energy into the weapons/shields, since they have no engines to worry about.
_________________
Confucious sayeth, don't wash cat while drunk!

[vanir]

+1 for Gharkal's post. I readily alter stats and RAW as GM to suit my own sensibilities, it's easier to run a game that makes sense to you as you spend less time looking things up.

Space defence stations are stable weapons platforms as well as being fairly single purpose as Gharkal said. They should run normally at the peak performance of an ISD or similar, and have a peak capability exceeding that of regular space battlecruisers.

In other words higher fire control ratings than starships (add +1D FC or more for any given weapon for the stability of the platform), and I'd actually increase normal weapons range and damage by up to 150%, eg. turbolaser cannon FC 4D, range 5-20/40/90, damage 5D.
For batteries however I drop back to regular individual weapon stats due to massed fire and power requirements, but seriously bump fire control for criss crossing field coverage, eg. medium turbolaser batteries FC 5D+2, range 3-15/35/75, damage 7D.
I also like to put high powered assault weapons with reduced range due to loss of beam strength over long ranges at such high power outputs. I might have assault turbolasers at FC 0D, range 3-10/20/50, damage 11D+2.
I also routinely double the maximum shielding capabilities of the station and assume equivalent dice in backup shields are always present.


Not saying you should do what I do but just an encouragement to freely modify your game so that it makes workable sense to you as GM.

[CRMcNeill]

I've always thought that Golan's needed anti-starfighter weaponry as well. They aren't so well armored and shielded that they could just shrug off a massed starfighter attack.
_________________
"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.

The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index

[jmanski]

Good point. I've always thought they needed more armor. If they are supposed to be a threat to ISDs then they need more.
_________________
Blasted rules. Why can't they just be perfect?

[CRMcNeill]

[garhkal]

Another agreed. BTB a golan has (thrawn trilogy source book)

Hull/Shield
Golan 1 = 4d/0d
Golan 2 = 4d/2d+2
Golan 3 = 5d+2/4d

By the Imp source book
Star destroyers have
Victory mk1 = 4d/3d+1
Victory mk2 = 4d+2/3d
ISD 1 = 7d/3d
ISD 2 = 7d+1/2d+2

So how in the heck can 3 GIIIs hold of 6 ISD IIs???

Sounds like we need to come up as fans with some proper stats for them.
_________________
Confucious sayeth, don't wash cat while drunk!

[CRMcNeill]

So, assuming Thrawn's attack force split evenly, with three Imperial II's per Golan, what would be the minimum dice level required for them to break even against a coordinated barrage from all three ships? And don't forget that the Golan's hull rating has to be high enough to shrug off combined blasts from the ion cannon as well.
_________________
"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.

The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index

[vanir]

Totally agree wrt point defence weaponry. Like what I did with our ISD and SSD, working from a website that examined the movie stats of these models and discussed the fact you can clearly see numerous small point defence lasers firing at Rebel starfighters from SSD/ISD trenches and superstructures in RotJ/EpVI scenes...I simply made a concession in our game that ISD and Golans or similar may not necessarily specify point defence lasers but have them as a CIWS for starfighter screening (although using anti-starfighter frigates is preferred).

I typically place about 20 point defence lasers firing individually on each arc for very large craft like a Station, able to coordinate in groupings of up to 5. Stats are conservative, typically FC 2D, range 1-3/10/17, damage 2D (so just a nuisance unless they coordinate fire, but if focused on one attacker figures are bumped by coordinated action to FC 5D damage 5D during an attack pass by the starfighter).


I do like to keep the SWU theme that massed starfighter attacks are effective in major warfare, however tactics are required such as distracting enemy fire with one group whilst attacking with another. But also that when speaking in terms of individual ships, large powerful craft are the king of space in a 1 for 1 type of conflict, being in a small manoeuvrable starfighter doesn't help you much unless you have lots of friends.

Shields like I said would double, for 8D on the Golan III with 8D backups. That'll scare ISD and more reflects a space station capabilities, it's the shield rating of something like a SSD and space dreadnaughts are pretty much like battle stations fitted with engines...or kind of like part of a starport-city put in space and fitted with engines.

[vanir]

Actually I was just thinking too, about a campaign our group did that involved a particular fleet of ISD throughout the campaign against our group and its efforts to build an effective Rebel substation against a finite enemy force, so throughout the campaign we did things like recorded damage to the Imperial forces so fewer would be available in the next encounter, things like that, so Players really felt like they were having an impact on the galaxy with their character actions.

One of the RP aspects we added to things like ISD and space stations was limited production capabilities, they're so big and so well equipped with resources and power that they function like small cities with a minor starport contained within.
So for example we would allow ISD to replenish their starfighter complement between encounters using on-board limited production facilities. For things like Golan space stations all sorts of special effects could be gained by the crews using the station systems between encounters and conflicts to reinforce their efforts as best they can.

So say for example, you put a Golan II way out in the Parthovian Cluster and hit it frequently with Rebel starfighter attacks. Well that station over the course of several months might attempt to use its resources and area influence to reinforce its defence capabilities, such as shielding systems and point defence systems, and it might try to focus installed maintenance facilities towards reinforced squadrons of Skiprays on base patrol and TIE/ln for interception duties...they might even go as far as begin installing light shields on their TIE, or overpowering the laser cannons and manoeuvring thrusters for say, a range cost (1 day consumables instead of 2).

Basically a little "off screen" RPG at the station itself among its command section and crew might be an advised tactic for GMs so that when you think about it, each individual space station becomes a unique, case specific kind of exercise. Individual stations could be highly customised to suit their mission profile or history of encounters.

[jmanski]

I'd say a Golan needs to be similar to an SSD at minimum.

BTW, autotext changes Golan to filaments....
_________________
Blasted rules. Why can't they just be perfect?

[lurker]