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CRMcNeill
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 Posted: Sun Apr 10, 2011 6:28 pm Post subject: Mnemiotic Drugs |
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These are mentioned briefly in the Imperial Sourcebook and the Last Command Sourcebook. The Imperial Sourcebook reads "The agents learn vast amounts during this period. Many agents have to be released because of overuse of the mnemiotic drugs given agents to enhance their learning. Those who survive with their minds intact know a great deal." The Last Command Sourcebook mentions the drugs only in passing (as part of the stats for Imperial Intelligence agents).
Mnemiotic drugs would seem to be an obvious solution for characters to boost their Knowledge skills, but there is no information on their use and its attendant hazards. What would be a realistic rule for using mnemiotic drugs in the RPG?
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jmanski
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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
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Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
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| Posted: Sun Apr 10, 2011 7:21 pm Post subject: |
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I was looking more for actual rules; this seemed more like a discussion of whether or not they should be used in the game. Thanks for the research, though.
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"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
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Bren
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| Posted: Sun Apr 10, 2011 7:50 pm Post subject: |
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Try using the rules for knowledge/technical skill cartridges for Cyborg Construct from Cracken’s Rebel Field Guide p. 31. Add in some risk where the more D’s of skills added, the higher the risk of a serious adverse event. I would also include the following from the link that jmanski provided http://rancorpit.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=2476&highlight=mnemonic.
| Tem_Starrunner wrote: | | I would imagine that the procedure to use Mnemonic drugs is very intense, dangerous, time consuming and labor intensive. Using Mnemonic drugs probably take a large medical team (20 or more) who need to monitor all biological functions (heart-rate, breathing, hormonal levels, mental functions and neurology) throughout treatment. The drug most like had a very low rate of success resulting, probably, in psychological damage and other undesired biological reactions (organ failure, hormonal imbalances and even death) |
And I would also add permanent neurological damage = to a permanent decrease in stats as a serious adverse event as well.
Just say no to drugs.  |
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CRMcNeill
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| Posted: Sun Apr 10, 2011 8:15 pm Post subject: |
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I agree for the most part; I'm just not sure that the side-effects are that extreme. The line in the Imperial Sourcebook specifies "overuse". To me, that implies something that could be used with relative safety at a reduced level, but the degree to which it is used for Intel agents can be dangerous
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"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
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Bren
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| Posted: Sun Apr 10, 2011 9:17 pm Post subject: |
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| crmcneill wrote: | | I agree for the most part; I'm just not sure that the side-effects are that extreme. The line in the Imperial Sourcebook specifies "overuse". To me, that implies something that could be used with relative safety at a reduced level, but the degree to which it is used for Intel agents can be dangerous |
Take a look at the side effects listed on the package insert for real, licensed, prescription drugs. Organ failure, neurological damage, and even death are definitely not unknown SAEs. To get a sense of what you might see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serious_adverse_event
Weird, experimental, unlicensed drugs are unlikely to be safer. Just adjust the probability of the really serious stuff to a level that makes you comfortable and relate it to how high the adds are. |
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cheshire
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| Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2011 8:25 am Post subject: |
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We probably also have to keep game balance in mind. If something were perfectly safe in set doses with little chance of adverse effects, then there would be no reason for players not to use them. Without putting certain restrictions it could seriously affect character development.
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Bren
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| Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2011 9:43 am Post subject: |
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| cheshire wrote: | | We probably also have to keep game balance in mind. If something were perfectly safe in set doses with little chance of adverse effects, then there would be no reason for players not to use them. Without putting certain restrictions it could seriously affect character development. |
I think both from a game balance perspective and from the fact that such drugs never appear in the movies and only appear in a couple of very limited cases in the entirety of the EU, they would be very uncommon and, as you say, less safe than legally available drugs. |
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garhkal
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| Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2011 6:57 pm Post subject: |
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| crmcneill wrote: | | I agree for the most part; I'm just not sure that the side-effects are that extreme. The line in the Imperial Sourcebook specifies "overuse". To me, that implies something that could be used with relative safety at a reduced level, but the degree to which it is used for Intel agents can be dangerous |
Hows about someting like this..
To increase know/tech skills
3d or lower - drug takes moderate (Medicine) roll. Side effect only on a roll of all 1s.
4d to 6d - drug takes difficult (Medicine) roll, and twice the level of dosage. Side effects incure on any 1 on the wild die, or a result of less than 5.
6d-8d - drug takes very difficult medicine roll, and 4 times the level of dosage. Requires a moderate stamina roll to NOT gain high blood pressure, and a difficult perception check to avoid tripping out. Failing either results in 1d days of medical issues. Side effects kick in on a failed medicine roll of less than 10.
8d+ - drugs take a heroic medicine roll, and 6 times the needed dosage.
Stamina/perception rolls go up to diff/very diff (20/25 respectfully). Failing those incure 1d months of hospitalization due to medical complications. Side effects occur on any roll of 10 LESS than what was needed.
To learn a new skill.
3d or less. - as above, but user has to apply the 6d-8d stamina test for high blood pressure.
4d-6d. As above, but if the (medicine) roll has all dice a 1, not only has user experienced excessive side effects, but can no longer take these mnemonic drugs as they are now alergic to them.
6d-8d. As 8d+ above level. Same above alergy comes in when ANY roll has a wild 1.
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Fallon Kell
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| Posted: Mon Apr 11, 2011 11:40 pm Post subject: |
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| cheshire wrote: | | We probably also have to keep game balance in mind. If something were perfectly safe in set doses with little chance of adverse effects, then there would be no reason for players not to use them. Without putting certain restrictions it could seriously affect character development. |
Maybe they're prohibitively expensive?
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CRMcNeill
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| Posted: Tue Apr 12, 2011 12:24 am Post subject: |
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I'm thinking of including them in the same vein as cybernetics; you can use them to enhance your natural performance, but at a risk of permanent mental damage (either in the form of insanity or brain / neural damage), and the likelihood of damage from mishaps goes up depending on how much of it you use.
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"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
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Esoomian
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| Posted: Tue Apr 12, 2011 12:30 am Post subject: |
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You could have whatever bonus the memonic drugs apply be applied as a penalty to willpower rolls so that the more 'enhanced' your intellect the less impulse control you have.
Actually if I were to use memonic drugs I'd make that a standard, known and unavoidable and have the risk of other side effects as well.
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CRMcNeill
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Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
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| Posted: Tue Apr 12, 2011 2:46 am Post subject: |
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| Esoomian wrote: | You could have whatever bonus the memonic drugs apply be applied as a penalty to willpower rolls so that the more 'enhanced' your intellect the less impulse control you have.
Actually if I were to use memonic drugs I'd make that a standard, known and unavoidable and have the risk of other side effects as well. |
I see it being more a Willpower roll of graduated difficulty depending on how much of the drug the character uses. I would think impulse control would be an important mental attribute for an Infiltration agent, and if Imperial Intelligence Infiltration agents all exhibit poor impulse control, that would be a major flag for Alliance Intel when they are trying to ID potential Infiltration agents. I can see it more as a side-effect for usage failure than a uniform effect.
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"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
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Esoomian
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| Posted: Tue Apr 12, 2011 1:26 pm Post subject: |
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Fair enough but I think that's still how I'd run it. That way only Infiltration Agents who have done some dedicated training to reinforce their impulse control would be viable candidates for drug based enhancement and even then only roughly 1D or so before they probably can't handle any further 'enhancement'
Sith and Dark Siders who perhaps want their emotions to run rampant and do want to take potentially dangerous shortcuts to getting knowledge they can exploit might be more free in their use of memonic drugs. After all they command the Force so they can stave off any dangerous side effects right? 
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Last edited by Esoomian on Tue Apr 12, 2011 1:52 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Bren
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| Posted: Tue Apr 12, 2011 1:29 pm Post subject: |
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| Esoomian wrote: | | After all they command the Force so they can stave off [any] dangerous side effects right? |
Riiiight...  |
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