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vong
Jedi
Joined: 30 Aug 2006
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Location: Ottawa, Canada
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 Posted: Fri Jun 18, 2010 10:22 am Post subject: Jedi Power Level |
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This is asking what do you think the various power levels for Padawan, Knight, Master are?
I have been looking around at various sources of builds of characters during the movies / books and come to see that for master, it seems to be about 25D in Force skills.
http://www.rancorpit.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=2868&start=0&postdays=0&postorder=asc
But I have not found where someone has just made knighthood - but i am guessing that would be somewhere in the 17D area would be the start of Knighthood.
And I am not sure about Padawan, but I think thats anything below knight
opinions?
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Ankhanu
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Joined: 13 Oct 2006
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| Posted: Fri Jun 18, 2010 10:29 am Post subject: |
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I haven't had super powerful Jedi in games I've played (or run), but based on what I've been able to do, somewhere in the 4-6D range for Force Skills I'm generally able to pull things off with some regularity... seems like an ok benchmark for Knighthood? Masters, I'm not sure, probably closer 25Dish mark (8D+ ea.).
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Gry Sarth
Jedi
Joined: 25 May 2004
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Location: Sao Paulo - Brazil
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| Posted: Fri Jun 18, 2010 10:33 am Post subject: |
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I'd say about 6D for padawans, 15D for Knights and 25D for Masters.
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Rerun941
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Joined: 27 Jul 2004
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Location: San Antonio, TX
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| Posted: Fri Jun 18, 2010 2:11 pm Post subject: |
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I must be extra stingy... I came up with this based on the descriptions of the relative skill levels used in Star Wars (pg 207 from the 2nd Ed R&E):
It's not formatted as nicely as I'd like, but I think you get the idea.
Relative Jedi Skill levels
Skill Dice, Rank, Title
FS, Initiate, Padawan
1D, Learner, Padawan
2D, Novice, Padawan
3D, Apprentice, Padawan
4D, Adept, Padawan
5D, Knight, Knight
6D, Knight
7D, Protector, Knight
8D, Knight
9D, Guardian, Knight
10D, Master, Master
11D, Master
12D, Grand Master, Master
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vong
Jedi
Joined: 30 Aug 2006
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Location: Ottawa, Canada
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| Posted: Fri Jun 18, 2010 3:19 pm Post subject: |
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not bad, might want to bring the master level down a bit, with it starting at 30D it is a bit steep 
the other two levels basically line up with our numbers.
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Gry Sarth
Jedi
Joined: 25 May 2004
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Location: Sao Paulo - Brazil
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| Posted: Fri Jun 18, 2010 4:37 pm Post subject: |
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Rerun, you're not being stingy. What you wrote is pretty much what everybody else is saying, only you stated the level for each individual Force skills, while the others are saying the amount of total Force skill dice, to be split between Control, Sense and Alter.
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ZzaphodD
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| Posted: Fri Jun 18, 2010 5:04 pm Post subject: |
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To represent the fact that Knights and Masters use the force as second nature I let characters have one power 'kept up' for free per 5D in Control. Also, when you reach 5D in Control powers requiring three skills only count as two actions.
This was done after I found out that several of the NPCs that was described as experienced Jedi couldnt get their LSC activated while doing something else. |
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hazardchris
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| Posted: Mon Jun 21, 2010 5:30 pm Post subject: |
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Here's how my "Jedi Chart" looks. The number listed is the lowest number of Force Skill dice that a given character can have before conferred a certain rank.
I would also go so far as to say that a person cannot be made a Jedi Knight without at least 3D in all three Force Skills.
Force Power Levels
Novice/Youngling: 0D+
Apprentice/Padawan: 2D+
Knight: 9D+
Master: 20D+ |
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Lostboy
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| Posted: Tue Jun 22, 2010 3:19 am Post subject: |
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| I always thought that level of force ability is only part of it. At the end of KOTOR Revan was quite possibly the most powerful force user in the galaxy but was given the rank of Knight, Freedon Nad was powerful and smart but was never made master. power isn't enough, it takes wisdom, so i use the players in game conduct to determine rank, but i keep in mind some jedi use deception for a greater good e.t.c. |
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vong
Jedi
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| Posted: Tue Jun 22, 2010 7:43 am Post subject: |
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| Lostboy wrote: | | I always thought that level of force ability is only part of it. At the end of KOTOR Revan was quite possibly the most powerful force user in the galaxy but was given the rank of Knight, Freedon Nad was powerful and smart but was never made master. power isn't enough, it takes wisdom, so i use the players in game conduct to determine rank, but i keep in mind some jedi use deception for a greater good e.t.c. |
I agree it takes wisdom, but it also takes knowledge of the force.
I think that these numbers is when you can face the trials. Kinda minimum values to have before you are even considered for said rank 
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cheshire
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| Posted: Tue Jun 22, 2010 9:08 am Post subject: |
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| vong wrote: |
I agree it takes wisdom, but it also takes knowledge of the force.
I think that these numbers is when you can face the trials. Kinda minimum values to have before you are even considered for said rank |
I had an issue with a group of gamers, an all-Jedi campaign. One of them kept asking what their Force ratings had to be before they were Jedi Knights. He liked simple quantifiable criteria with which to compare himself. I kept telling him that he was a Jedi Knight when he faced his internal struggles, discovered what being a Jedi meant, and used his internal resolutions to defeat an external threat along with the Force as his ally.
I'm not sure that being a Jedi is really about criteria. Of course, a lot of that has to do with my own understandings of mythology and theology that colors my understanding of the Jedi.
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hazardchris
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| Posted: Tue Jun 22, 2010 9:13 am Post subject: |
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| Oh, I completely agree, you have to have something other than knowledge of the Force to become a Jedi Knight. Not just skills, but in deeds and accomplishments. My table is by no means a guide to when you become a Jedi Knight, is more of a reference table for me when I'm designing NPC's to get an idea of their power level. |
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ZzaphodD
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| Posted: Tue Jun 22, 2010 2:48 pm Post subject: |
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| Looking at the movies, especially the later ones, one can see that a 'knight' should be able to activate a difficult forcepower (perhaps with two skills) at the same time as hes doing one or two other actions. This is at most four actions at target number 20. To be able to do this with a reasonable rate of succes this would mean around 9-10D in the force skill in question. |
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vong
Jedi
Joined: 30 Aug 2006
Posts: 6699
Location: Ottawa, Canada
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| Posted: Tue Jun 22, 2010 2:53 pm Post subject: |
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| ZzaphodD wrote: | | Looking at the movies, especially the later ones, one can see that a 'knight' should be able to activate a difficult forcepower (perhaps with two skills) at the same time as hes doing one or two other actions. This is at most four actions at target number 20. To be able to do this with a reasonable rate of succes this would mean around 9-10D in the force skill in question. |
and if you look at Obiwan he doesnt even have 30D. that would mean that Master Kenobi is not even a knight?
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Ankhanu
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| Posted: Tue Jun 22, 2010 3:16 pm Post subject: |
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| vong wrote: | | ZzaphodD wrote: | | Looking at the movies, especially the later ones, one can see that a 'knight' should be able to activate a difficult forcepower (perhaps with two skills) at the same time as hes doing one or two other actions. This is at most four actions at target number 20. To be able to do this with a reasonable rate of succes this would mean around 9-10D in the force skill in question. |
and if you look at Obiwan he doesnt even have 30D. that would mean that Master Kenobi is not even a knight? |
The problem is the wrench that the Prequels tossed into the game system.
Jedi are far crazier in the Prequels than we see in the Original Trilogy, and the game system and Jedi stats were designed with the original reference material. Comparing the system with the prequels will leave a gulf between the mechanics and what we see. What ZzaphodD says makes sense... but it doesn't make sense in the context of the original material.
I guess part of what has to be decided is whether you want to emulate the prequel power levels, or stay faithful to the game concept.
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