Force points and failures

[Esoomian]

As far as I recall if someone uses a force point at a dramatically appropriate time to do something heroic then they should get the force point back and an additional force point right?

Well what happens if they fail despite spending the force point? Do they get points for effort?

It came up in one of my games recently where a non-combat player (the medic) happened to be the only player around when danger threatened an NPC. He spent his force point and bravely threw himself in harms way to save the NPC... and then promptly rolled a critical fumble and instead tackled her head first into a wall.

I was not really prepared for this so after the combat was resolved (another PC managed to sprint back in time to save everyone) I gave him the force point he spent back and after much cajoling I gave him another one because he had tried to be heroic and put himself between the NPC and certain death he just happened to well suck.

On another tangent would you give someone a darkside point if they attempted to do something undeniably evil and failed (IE spend a force point to shoot a good friend in the back, betraying him for the bounty on his head only to find out that your blaster has been broken since you fell in the river last game session and is not going to fire no matter how awesome your to hit roll is.)?
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[Orgaloth]

With the first one, I would have just given the spent fp back and not the additional one.

As for the dsp, I would in your case, since you gave that extra point out. The char was fully willing to do the deed, so yep, here have the dsp for it.

My opinion though.
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[Ray]

Actually, I don't think they should. Their faith in $Diety/Higherpower would be shattered.

They could touch the power and ability of said thing, and it was still insufficient to save the day.

If anything, it would count to me as an ample opportunity to have a great RPing session about getting faith back!

Or, better yet, finding the SOB that caused such a problem and sending them to THEIR $Diety/Higherpower.

[Esoomian]

[Ankhanu]

Intent is just as, if not more important than outcome, when it comes to the Force. Even with failure, I'd award FP expenditure as suggested, and apply DSPs when attempting evil, but failing. Bumbling is less important than the effort.
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[Jedi Skyler]

I agree with Ankhanu. It's the INTENT more than the DEED itself.

I don't recall ever reading anything that said the FP and the extra FP were only given after a SUCCESS...it is done after the character ACTS IN A HEROIC MANNER, at a dramatically appropriate time.

As far as I can tell, it doesn't matter if the character made the NPC so scared they defacated in their drawers. If they TRIED to act heroically, they get rewarded. This is another example of ROLEplaying versus ROLLplaying.

[garhkal]

[Jedi Skyler]

I hear where you're coming from, garhkal. However, I personally have a problem with the Force failing to help you out when you need it most, then holding you responsible for it on top of it all...

But that's just my humble opinion. As GM, you'll have to decide how you want to do it.

[vong]

I agree, you decide before the roll if the action is worthy of a FP, then what happens happens. Same goes for DSP the intent not result.

"you fill yourself full of the dark side then trip. no dsp for you." doesnt make much sense to me
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[ifurin]

i have to agree with vong, skylar, and ankhanu. it's all about the intent, although i do reward for outcome. i recently had a player spend a force point in order to save his comrades from a pack of wild animals. he probably would have been able to do it except that the squib rolled really good on his "damage" roll for his animal excluder and the animals fled. since the force point was spent in an attempt to save his friends i rewarded him with his force point back. he tried he was just beat to the punch by stroke of someone else's luck.

[garhkal]

To me the reasoning i said how i did, is how i view being heroic. Doing the right thing is what makes you a hero. Thinking about or attempting to do it but not succeeding imo does not.
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[Ankhanu]

I would disagree, especially since the Force is attuned to an individual's intent, as well as the result of their actions. This is the same reason why using Injure/Kill results in a DSP even if it is used to subdue a force of evil who is attempting to unleash evil upon the galaxy; whether the result is positive or negative, the end doesn't justify the means. The intent, in that case, is to use the Force for harm, whether it is successful or not is unimportant... much like calling upon the Dark Side, whether you succeed or fail, you get the DSP.
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[Revenant]