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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010
Posts: 16345
Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
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 Posted: Fri Aug 19, 2016 11:16 pm Post subject: |
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| Whill wrote: | | MrNexx wrote: | | "An ion pistol's blast has no effect on organic targets..." |
| CRMcNeill wrote: | | This does nothing to clear up whether ion blasts effect organic parts. |
It doesn't? |
Not really, no. What we're going at is whether or not an ion blast's damage carries over from cybernetic parts into the cyborg to whom they are attached. The Ion Pistol specifies that it has no effect on organics unless the organic is a cyborg. Okay, so how does it effect them? Does it merely make the cyborg's cybernetic parts temporarily fritz out, or does the cyborg take stun or normal damage through his connection to his cybernetics? No clues given.
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"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index
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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010
Posts: 16345
Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
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| Posted: Fri Aug 19, 2016 11:25 pm Post subject: |
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Incidentally, here's what I'm thinking...Corellian Reflex Suit
Model: Corellian Reflex Suit
Type: Powersuit Body Armor
Scale: Character
Cost: 40,000
Availability: 3,R
Effect: +2D vs. physical damage, +1D vs. energy damage, -1D to Dexterity.
Game Notes:
-The Reflex Suit is equipped with a highly sensitive exo-skeletal musculature system that supports the weight of the armor and synchronizes itself with his movements. When active, this system negates the -1D penalty to Dexterity.
-The musculature can also be used to enhance the wearer's Lifting and Brawling damage, but the armor must spend a round reconfiguring itself, during which the wearer may take no action and must remain stationary. While in Strength mode, the character gains +2D to Lifting and +1D to Brawling damage.
-If the musculature system is disabled for any reason, the wearer suffers an additional -1D penalty to Strength and Dexterity.
_________________
"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index
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MrNexx
Rear Admiral
Joined: 25 Mar 2016
Posts: 2248
Location: San Antonio
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| Posted: Sat Aug 20, 2016 9:08 am Post subject: |
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| CRMcNeill wrote: | | MrNexx wrote: | AH-HAH! I found a reference in REUP!
Page 353, under the "Ion Pistol"
"An ion pistol’s blast has no effect on organic targets,
unless such targets have cybernetic replacements."
So, I would say an ion pistol aimed at a cyborg affects it like a droid. |
Okay, but what KIND of effect? This does nothing to clear up whether ion blasts effect organic parts. I don't think anyone is arguing that exposed cybernetics would be unaffected by an ion blast just because they are connected to a living being... |
For my part, I'm going with the idea that the cybernetic interface makes you entirely vulnerable to ion weapons... if someone hits Luke Skywalker with an ion weapon (and he doesn't Absorb/Dissipate it), he'll take full damage from it, because his cybernetic hand isn't just a hand, but a connection to his nervous system.
Partially, it's ease of use. And I would probably be happier if Ion weapons were simply stun weapons when used against living targets (I can't imagine that getting hit with a stream of ionizing particles is particularly fun, and the RAW lets a naked person survive dancing on an anti-orbital ion cannon while it fires, which is just silly), but as written, there's no indication that the effect on cybernetic targets is any different than the effect on robotic targets.
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“We're going to win this war, not by fighting what we hate, but saving what we love.”
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MrNexx
Rear Admiral
Joined: 25 Mar 2016
Posts: 2248
Location: San Antonio
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| Posted: Sat Aug 20, 2016 9:10 am Post subject: |
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Mental image: anti-orbital ion cannon is firing. Unfortunately for the Rebels, a bird is flying by, and gets in the path of the cannon. The bird is unharmed, but the blast is stopped before it goes into space.
_________________
"I've Seen Your Daily Routine. You Are Not Busy!"
“We're going to win this war, not by fighting what we hate, but saving what we love.”
http://rpgcrank.blogspot.com/ |
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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010
Posts: 16345
Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
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| Posted: Sat Aug 20, 2016 1:40 pm Post subject: |
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| MrNexx wrote: | | For my part, I'm going with the idea that the cybernetic interface makes you entirely vulnerable to ion weapons... if someone hits Luke Skywalker with an ion weapon (and he doesn't Absorb/Dissipate it), he'll take full damage from it, because his cybernetic hand isn't just a hand, but a connection to his nervous system. |
I've been considering something more along the lines of allowing ion weapons to inflict both ionization and normal damage, with the normal damage being 2D or 3D lower than the weapon's listed damage (I haven't decided which). This would represent the energy delivered by the simple impact of a bolt of subatomic particles. For instance, using the -3D option, if a Y-Wing hits a Starfighter-Scale target with its ion cannon, it would inflict 4D ionization damage, but it would also inflict 1D normal damage. This isn't enough to do any real damage, but smaller scale targets (with the scale modifier added in) would be in greater danger not only of burning out their electronics from ionization overload, but from taking actual damage both from the electrical disruption and the kinetic impact.
I haven't really ironed out all the details, but all it would really take is rolling Damage vs. Soak twice.
EDIT: With the Wild Dice effect thrown in, it'd also be a great way to represent ionization blowing out systems with permanent damage, too.
_________________
"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index
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MrNexx
Rear Admiral
Joined: 25 Mar 2016
Posts: 2248
Location: San Antonio
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| Posted: Sat Aug 20, 2016 3:07 pm Post subject: |
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| CRMcNeill wrote: | | MrNexx wrote: | | For my part, I'm going with the idea that the cybernetic interface makes you entirely vulnerable to ion weapons... if someone hits Luke Skywalker with an ion weapon (and he doesn't Absorb/Dissipate it), he'll take full damage from it, because his cybernetic hand isn't just a hand, but a connection to his nervous system. |
I've been considering something more along the lines of allowing ion weapons to inflict both ionization and normal damage, with the normal damage being 2D or 3D lower than the weapon's listed damage (I haven't decided which). This would represent the energy delivered by the simple impact of a bolt of subatomic particles. For instance, using the -3D option, if a Y-Wing hits a Starfighter-Scale target with its ion cannon, it would inflict 4D ionization damage, but it would also inflict 1D normal damage. This isn't enough to do any real damage, but smaller scale targets (with the scale modifier added in) would be in greater danger not only of burning out their electronics from ionization overload, but from taking actual damage both from the electrical disruption and the kinetic impact.
I haven't really ironed out all the details, but all it would really take is rolling Damage vs. Soak twice.
EDIT: With the Wild Dice effect thrown in, it'd also be a great way to represent ionization blowing out systems with permanent damage, too. |
Why roll twice? It's the same attack, just roll one soak and have it equally effective against both damages. So, I roll my 3D hull dice, and you roll your 4D Ion and 1D Standard. I roll a 10.5 (my curse of averageness strikes again!), and you roll 14 on your Ion damage... I take a bit of an ion hit. But, unless you roll CRAZY good on your 1D standard, I ignore it. If you DO roll crazy good, I crash into a planet.
_________________
"I've Seen Your Daily Routine. You Are Not Busy!"
“We're going to win this war, not by fighting what we hate, but saving what we love.”
http://rpgcrank.blogspot.com/ |
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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010
Posts: 16345
Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
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| Posted: Sat Aug 20, 2016 3:11 pm Post subject: |
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| MrNexx wrote: | | Why roll twice? |
Because it enhances the random effect factor. Requiring two Hull rolls increases the chances of one roll going particularly bad or good.
_________________
"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index
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garhkal
Sovereign Protector
Joined: 17 Jul 2005
Posts: 14253
Location: Reynoldsburg, Columbus, Ohio.
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| Posted: Sat Aug 20, 2016 4:33 pm Post subject: |
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| MrNexx wrote: |
For my part, I'm going with the idea that the cybernetic interface makes you entirely vulnerable to ion weapons... if someone hits Luke Skywalker with an ion weapon (and he doesn't Absorb/Dissipate it), he'll take full damage from it, because his cybernetic hand isn't just a hand, but a connection to his nervous system.
Partially, it's ease of use. And I would probably be happier if Ion weapons were simply stun weapons when used against living targets (I can't imagine that getting hit with a stream of ionizing particles is particularly fun, and the RAW lets a naked person survive dancing on an anti-orbital ion cannon while it fires, which is just silly), but as written, there's no indication that the effect on cybernetic targets is any different than the effect on robotic targets. |
Plus we have evidence from the novels, where someone got hit by ion damage (Mara jade hit when she ejected), and suffered nerve damage..
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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010
Posts: 16345
Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
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| Posted: Sat Aug 20, 2016 5:27 pm Post subject: |
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| garhkal wrote: | | Plus we have evidence from the novels, where someone got hit by ion damage (Mara jade hit when she ejected), and suffered nerve damage.. |
But was the nerve damage from the ion blast itself or the fact that the ion blast shorted out her life support system? Lack of oxygen causes nerve damage, too.
EDIT: Went back and read the appropriate chapters. She was unconscious she because she got hit in the helmet by battle debris after she ejected. | Quote: | | Mara was unconscious when they found her, both from a dangerously depleted air supply and from what was probably a mild concussion. |
No mention of ionization affecting her, even though her crippled Z-95 took a direct hit from capital-scale ion cannon on one of the Katana Dreadnaughts.
_________________
"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index
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garhkal
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| Posted: Sun Aug 21, 2016 1:03 am Post subject: |
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From the way i read it, it seemed the nerve damage she received was more due to the Ion blast, not lack of life support..
BUT i could be mistaken.
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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010
Posts: 16345
Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
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| Posted: Sun Aug 21, 2016 1:31 am Post subject: |
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I believe you are. If you read the section, she suffers no injury from the ion cannon hit, and doesn't get knocked out until after she has ejected.
_________________
"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index
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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010
Posts: 16345
Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
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| Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2016 1:25 pm Post subject: |
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garhkal, just to clarify, are you basing your understanding of ion cannon in the SWU on the Particle Projection Cannon from Battletech?
_________________
"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index
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garhkal
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| Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2016 2:41 pm Post subject: |
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No. I am basing them on the rules in the 1e, 2e and 2e revised main rule book as well as what we see in novels.
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CRMcNeill
Director of Engineering
Joined: 05 Apr 2010
Posts: 16345
Location: Redding System, California Sector, on the I-5 Hyperspace Route.
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| Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2016 4:31 pm Post subject: |
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| garhkal wrote: | | No. I am basing them on the rules in the 1e, 2e and 2e revised main rule book as well as what we see in novels. |
So do you picture ion cannon as a charged energy effect that disrupts electricity by delivering more electricity, or as a negative effect that drains energy away?
_________________
"No set of rules can cover every situation. It's expected that you will make up new rules to suit the needs of your game." - The Star Wars Roleplaying Game, 2R&E, pg. 69, WEG, 1996.
The CRMcNeill Stat/Rule Index
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MrNexx
Rear Admiral
Joined: 25 Mar 2016
Posts: 2248
Location: San Antonio
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| Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2016 4:42 pm Post subject: |
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| CRMcNeill wrote: | | garhkal wrote: | | No. I am basing them on the rules in the 1e, 2e and 2e revised main rule book as well as what we see in novels. |
So do you picture ion cannon as a charged energy effect that disrupts electricity by delivering more electricity, or as a negative effect that drains energy away? |
For me, I view it as a charged attack which disrupts SW equivalents of circuits, damaging sections so they must be actively repaired... As noted in dealing with ion damage in ships. Perhaps the lowest results are just "breakers" flipped and things needing rerouted, but higher levels will fry your brain... If you're a droid or chromehead.
Is there a derogatory term in SW for those with lots of cybernetics?
_________________
"I've Seen Your Daily Routine. You Are Not Busy!"
“We're going to win this war, not by fighting what we hate, but saving what we love.”
http://rpgcrank.blogspot.com/ |
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