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Rimmer
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Joined: 14 Mar 2010
Posts: 26
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 Posted: Sat May 08, 2010 4:45 pm Post subject: Whoops, wrong wules. |
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Having played SW D6 for so long now, I never actually look at the core book any more, my group just plays with the character sheets and a lot of D6, half the time the character sheets arn't even used.
Now imagine my surprise when I happen to re read the book (2nd Ed RE) and find out we have been using the old 2nd ed combined action rules and not 2nd RE, I may have to go through the book a little more to find out if we have been doing other things wrong as well.
Does any one else find the 2nd ed RE combined action rules to be a little underpowered compared to the original 2nd ed rules ? |
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Grimace
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Joined: 11 Oct 2004
Posts: 729
Location: Montana; Big Sky Country
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| Posted: Sat May 08, 2010 7:20 pm Post subject: |
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| Why yes...I do think they are. Thus why I ignored the R&E version. |
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Raven Redstar
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Joined: 10 Mar 2009
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Location: Salem, OR
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| Posted: Sat May 08, 2010 9:54 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Does any one else find the 2nd ed RE combined action rules to be a little underpowered compared to the original 2nd ed rules ? |
The only thing that limits the rules are the caps put on command. To be honest, I would remove those for the most part. A general with 10D command is not limited to being able to coordinate 10 characters, I'm sorry, they're used to coordinating thousands.
These rules are quite a bit more potent than standard 2E if you remove the cap. 2nd Ed standard caps you at +15D for coordinating 1500 people. Where as, 2E:R&E if you successfully coordinate 1500 people you take the highest person's skill out of the group, then add in +1D for every 3. That comes out to: +500D. Now at the lower levels of it, it's a bit less potent, +1 per person beyond the first, instead of +1D for 2, +2D for 4 and so on. When you start getting into the 20-30 range, combining actions is fantastic, much better than the older rules. |
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Ankhanu
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Joined: 13 Oct 2006
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Location: Nova Scotia, Canada
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| Posted: Sun May 09, 2010 11:54 am Post subject: |
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Combined action bonuses so rarely came up in my games, as it was usually only one person helping another; which barely makes a difference.
But on a more general note, I find that I use a lot of 2e rules rather than R&E rules for much the same reason. For example, I don't use the R&E reaction rules, either you declare it, or you're not doin' it; I find being able to tack them on at the end if you need them a bit cheap.
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ZzaphodD
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Joined: 28 Nov 2009
Posts: 2426
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| Posted: Sun May 09, 2010 3:12 pm Post subject: Re: Whoops, wrong wules. |
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| Rimmer wrote: | | I may have to go through the book a little more to find out if we have been doing other things wrong as well. |
This is where you lost me. How can you do RPGs 'wrong'. If it works for you, dont fix it! |
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Rimmer
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Joined: 14 Mar 2010
Posts: 26
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| Posted: Sun May 09, 2010 4:08 pm Post subject: Re: Whoops, wrong wules. |
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| ZzaphodD wrote: | | Rimmer wrote: | | I may have to go through the book a little more to find out if we have been doing other things wrong as well. |
This is where you lost me. How can you do RPGs 'wrong'. If it works for you, dont fix it! |
When I say doing it wrong, I mean in the context of RAW, its always good to first understand the RAW before you go and house rule it, in this case, methinks we will continue to use 2E and not 2RE when it comes to combined actions.
oh, and thanks to Raven Redstar for some good advice. |
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ZzaphodD
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Joined: 28 Nov 2009
Posts: 2426
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| Posted: Sun May 09, 2010 4:36 pm Post subject: Re: Whoops, wrong wules. |
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| Rimmer wrote: | | ZzaphodD wrote: | | Rimmer wrote: | | I may have to go through the book a little more to find out if we have been doing other things wrong as well. |
This is where you lost me. How can you do RPGs 'wrong'. If it works for you, dont fix it! |
When I say doing it wrong, I mean in the context of RAW, its always good to first understand the RAW before you go and house rule it... |
I can understand that when you are learning a new game system.
In this case you have a long time running game with rules that work perfect for you. In that case I see no point (except for plain curiosity) in going through the rules to see what you are doing 'wrong'.
Of course I dont want to tell you what to do, I just pointed out I cant see that its going to do you any good as you are allready enjoying your games. |
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atgxtg
Rear Admiral
Joined: 22 Mar 2009
Posts: 2460
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| Posted: Sun May 16, 2010 11:58 pm Post subject: Re: Whoops, wrong wules. |
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| Rimmer wrote: | | Does any one else find the 2nd ed RE combined action rules to be a little underpowered compared to the original 2nd ed rules ? |
YES!
I've made a few pots here about that. In 2R&E a master general with 12D Command can only coordinate a dozen men.
I think the way it should work is that the difficulty should go up for larger numbers of troops. Something like going up 1 level per each multiple of skill, or each doubling. |
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MA-3PO
Lieutenant Commander
Joined: 17 Apr 2005
Posts: 236
Location: Olathe, Kansas
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| Posted: Mon May 17, 2010 12:09 am Post subject: |
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| For some characters, stormtroopers for example, I automatically give them the combined bonus without even rolling. Coordinating their actions is basically the main thing they are trained to do so I find it silly to roll every time. |
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garhkal
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Joined: 17 Jul 2005
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Location: Reynoldsburg, Columbus, Ohio.
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| Posted: Mon May 17, 2010 8:16 am Post subject: |
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That is one thing i always butt heads with our council in sparks with, that storm troopers are (or should be) Trained enough to use combined fire without someone commanding them, and IF they have to thy can go beyond the number of people their D would indicate.
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Whill
Dark Lord of the Jedi (Owner/Admin)
Joined: 14 Apr 2008
Posts: 10435
Location: Columbus, Ohio, USA, Earth, The Solar System, The Milky Way Galaxy
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| Posted: Mon May 17, 2010 10:11 am Post subject: |
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| MA-3PO wrote: | | For some characters, stormtroopers for example, I automatically give them the combined bonus without even rolling. Coordinating their actions is basically the main thing they are trained to do so I find it silly to roll every time. |
| garhkal wrote: | | storm troopers are (or should be) Trained enough to use combined fire without someone commanding them, and IF they have to thy can go beyond the number of people their D would indicate. |
The Rules Companion (1989, "1.5 e") has special rules for stormtroopes combining actions. It says there is no limit to the number of troppers that may combine actions, and that the "lead" tropper automatically shifts to another trooper if the first lead is wounded during combat. Even though the rules for combined actions changed, it seems that they just dropped stormies getting any special considerations for combined actions in 2e and R&E.
Even in the current system, as an option the GM could determine that stormtroopers have a very easy difficulty based on their skill (training) and ability to work together. Or you could even go as far creating a specialization of the command skill called "Stormtrooper Coordination" that only stormies have, which allows them to use that instead of command for combining purposes.
I'm not advocating one combine method over the other. I'm just throwing out ideas. It was a lot simpler in 1.1 and 1.5 when the characters that assisted the lead characters just provided a +1 pip for every die they had in the skill to the lead character's roll. We used to say "I'll pip him" to mean I'll support/combine with another character.
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bobenhotep
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Joined: 16 Dec 2009
Posts: 333
Location: New Mexico
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| Posted: Fri Jun 18, 2010 5:26 pm Post subject: |
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I use 2nd ed rules, with my own spin on things. you do initiative, then declare # of actions, declare actions, then roll to determine what happens. you can change actions if you have an action declared. but you cant add them after declaring # of actions
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