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Ankhanu
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 Posted: Sat Oct 20, 2007 6:00 pm Post subject: |
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Well, technically pushing them with telekinesis as an attack manoeuvre is a DSP by the RAW...
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Esoomian
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| Posted: Sat Oct 20, 2007 6:05 pm Post subject: |
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Even to oferbalance them and gain an advantage in combat? That seems a little harsh. Sure using telekinesis to push someone off a cliff would be evil but to make them stumble, that seems a little too light for a DSP
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Matthias777
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Joined: 08 Aug 2007
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| Posted: Sat Oct 20, 2007 7:19 pm Post subject: |
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I just said that it shouldn't automatically warrant a DSP. If lethal force (no pun intended) was the only way (within reason) to resolve the threat, then I don't see how it could warrant a DSP. But you have to think...there are a lot of ways you could deal with most things without using lethal force. Luke (in the EU) kept from killing some baddies that he easily could have, out of a sense of what was right.
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cheshire
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| Posted: Sat Oct 20, 2007 7:52 pm Post subject: |
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| Esoomian wrote: | So using telekinesis to crush someone with a giant bolder might not be inherently evil?
I suppose it's no more evil than slicing them in twain with a lightsaber. |
Generally the idea is that using the Force to kill another being is evil because the Force is generated by all living things. To use the Force to kill a source of the Force is supposed to be evil because of the inherent conflict of the act. Tripping someone with the Force isn't evil as it doesn't cause serious harm.
You are supposed to be able to use the Force to augment your combat skills, and thus the lightsaber is different than killing with Force lightning.
However, smashing someone with a boulder the size of a truck seems to lie somewhere in the middle. The boulder isn't your own natural ability, nor is it using the Force directly on the person. Apparently WEG went with the notion that since Vader was the only one who was seen smashing people with telekinetically hurled objects, it must lie on the evil side of that very thin line. |
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Matthias777
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| Posted: Sat Oct 20, 2007 8:10 pm Post subject: |
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While it wasn't a nice thing to do, I don't think I would give NPC Vader a DSP for tossing debris at Luke on Bespin. And definitely not one DSP every time he did it...that would be like...10 DSPs. 
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Ankhanu
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| Posted: Sat Oct 20, 2007 8:34 pm Post subject: |
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and my the rules, the only 10 CP he'd earn through most of that session 
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Jedi Skyler
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| Posted: Sun Oct 21, 2007 2:40 am Post subject: |
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| cheshire wrote: | | Apparently WEG went with the notion that since Vader was the only one who was seen smashing people with telekinetically hurled objects, it must lie on the evil side of that very thin line. |
Part of the tragedy that WEG didn't retain the rights...especially after we began to see the Jedi using the Force for Force Pushing and dropping huge mechanical components on top of guard droids... |
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Esoomian
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| Posted: Sun Oct 21, 2007 3:33 pm Post subject: |
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Would you get DSPs for destroying droids with TK? They're not alive so it'd be like using TK to wrench open a door.
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vong
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| Posted: Sun Oct 21, 2007 3:35 pm Post subject: |
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hmm, i would have to say no, as they are not alive...
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cheshire
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| Posted: Sun Oct 21, 2007 4:16 pm Post subject: |
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Ahh... now here is where we get into the dilema. It is not appropriate to TK kill a living being as the Force is, essentially, destroying part of itself. Droids are tools, and not a part of the Force. Thus telekinetically crunching one is kosher. But where do the Vong fall?
The Vong seem absent from the Force. If the Force is not in them is the Force generated in those living beings?
Personally, I say that using the Force to rip out a Vong's spleen is evil. I also think that the cannon explanation of why it is evil to use the Force to kill something is really hokey. I tend to go with Yoda and say, "There is no 'why.'" Mystical energy fields don't need rational justification for their ethics. |
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vong
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| Posted: Sun Oct 21, 2007 4:19 pm Post subject: |
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| cheshire wrote: | Ahh... now here is where we get into the dilema. It is not appropriate to TK kill a living being as the Force is, essentially, destroying part of itself. Droids are tools, and not a part of the Force. Thus telekinetically crunching one is kosher. But where do the Vong fall?
The Vong seem absent from the Force. If the Force is not in them is the Force generated in those living beings?
Personally, I say that using the Force to rip out a Vong's spleen is evil. I also think that the cannon explanation of why it is evil to use the Force to kill something is really hokey. I tend to go with Yoda and say, "There is no 'why.'" Mystical energy fields don't need rational justification for their ethics. |
A jedi can feel a droid in the force, so the argument between a droid and vong falls short to me.
A vong is alive in the sense of the word, so it is evil to kill them directly with the force 
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Esoomian
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| Posted: Sun Oct 21, 2007 8:12 pm Post subject: |
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However if a Jedi didn't know the vong was alive, say it was an inexperienced jedi with very little in sense it might be possible to belive a Vong is a replica droid... at least until the first time you use the force to turn it insideout 
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Ankhanu
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| Posted: Sun Oct 21, 2007 8:31 pm Post subject: |
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That's a bit of a stretch 
The Force responds less to the outcome and more to the intent of the wielder as well... so it takes away some of the ambiguity.
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cheshire
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| Posted: Sun Oct 21, 2007 11:42 pm Post subject: |
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| Esoomian wrote: | | However if a Jedi didn't know the vong was alive, say it was an inexperienced jedi with very little in sense it might be possible to belive a Vong is a replica droid... at least until the first time you use the force to turn it insideout |
Uh-huh... I'm pretty sure that mystical energy fields do not have committees that evaluate extenuating circumstances as the Dark Side of this same energy field wets your appetite for power. |
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Esoomian
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| Posted: Mon Oct 22, 2007 1:18 am Post subject: |
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| Ankhanu wrote: | That's a bit of a stretch
The Force responds less to the outcome and more to the intent of the wielder as well... so it takes away some of the ambiguity. |
I'm not saying it's not a stretch but there is the possibility that with the right circumstances one might not be aware they're using the force to snuff out a life.
However we are somewhat off target at this point. Unless someone changes this thread to Vong vs. The Force or something 
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