Stormtroopers - Minions or Elite?

[Barrataria]

[wildfire]

[garhkal]

On the subject of elite army units etc, what of vehicle/walker units?
How do you all grade them?
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Confucious sayeth, don't wash cat while drunk!

[Whill]

[cynanbloodbane]

When your first attempt at a clone army is a bunch of Boba Fett look alikes, most fans just assume that there is nowhere to go but down from there, so why bother with lesser clones at all... You might as well train the the old fassion way as clone Dengar or Gredo!
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"Yes because killing the guy you always planned on usurping and killing anyways in order to save your own kid, totally atones for murdering a roomful of innocent trusting children." The Brain

[Theodrim]

The way I always play it, the "default" Stormtrooper is as listed in the books, using the prototypical Stormtrooper tactic: no dodging, no real tactics, just an albeit, heavily armed and armored) human wave that constantly advances until one side or another is defeated. Notable units, such as the 501st, all use the veteran template from the Thrawn trilogy sourcebook (that alone makes them well-deserving of the namesake), but use the same tactics unless they're (likely) competently commanded.

...which is where things get interesting in my games, who commands them. Even your run-of-the-mill Stormtrooper can be exceedingly dangerous to an experienced party when they're being competently led (especially by noteworthy/named NPC's). You can get a ton of mileage out of Stormtroopers simply by switching up their tactics, on the simple basis of different commanding officers with different priorities, attitudes towards the enemy and their men, preferences, and strategies.

Another note, in the game I'm currently running (set just before the Battle of Yavin) the surviving Fett clones (that are of sound mind and body) have either been made commanders or consolidated into the 501st; those that aren't of sound mind or body were pushed into the Dark Trooper program as phase Zeroes. Dealing with those guys is the next major story arc in my game, since the game is set just before Storm Commandos show up, and way before the Dark Trooper project itself (in fact, if things work out the way I plan, it'll be the destruction of the phase Zero project at the hands of the PC's that prompts the Empire to develop Storm Commandos).

My players have already tangled with the 501st once and are definitely not eager to do it again.

[Zarm R'keeg]

[Whill]

[DougRed4]

In another thread I posted a link to a great discussion about Incom and the Empire on another forum. In that discussion one person pointed the following out about stormtroopers (the greater conversation being about the Empire and some of their failings):

>>This is also the reason Stormtroopers kind of suck--the really competent ones get tapped for Imperial Guard duty, instead of getting put in charge of squadrons of their own that they could work with and improve. Meanwhile, every Naval officer on a Star Destroyer who's not wearing a helmet of some kind is more of a politician than a military professional.<<

I thought this portion was relevant to the discussion here.
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Currently Running: Villains & Vigilantes (a 32-year-old campaign with multiple groups) and D6 Star Wars; mostly on hiatus are Adventures in Middle-earth and Delta Green

[Zarm R'keeg]

This could also go under 'official rules,' I suppose, but this is the thread I'm most familiar with. So, a question that's been niggling at my mind for quite some time...

On the Stormtrooper stats, are the Dexterity and Strength skills provided with the Strength bonuses and Dexterity penalties already built in (since they are typically 'always' in armor), or are the stats provided those for the men and women inside the shells, for the Narrator to manually subtract those penalties from?

I've always assumed the latter- but clearly, if the wrong assumption is applied in either-case, it could seesaw the Stormtroopers-as-statted into far higher or lower power levels than intended. (I.E. if it's already built-in with reduced dexterity, and you reduce it again on the assumption it hasn't been.)

Playing it as I assumed results in Stormtroopers who are usually wounded or unharmed from the average blaster bolt (a slow battle of attrition), but also constantly challenged to hit anything. Going the other direction would result in Stormtroopers with better marksmanship- but greater vulnerability (since their armor's bonus is already 'built in' to the strength stat).

Thoughts?
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Star Wars: Marvels, the audio drama: www.nolinecinemas.com

Hard core OT, all the way!

[garhkal]