Fatigue rules??

[garhkal]

Some game systems have rules for fatigue, where you make a periodic check against XYZ to see if you tire out. Stamina is supposed to be that skill for WEG SW but there is no in game listing for how long you need to 'operate' before making a skill roll to see if you get fatigued.

In this thread it was proposed that it be tied to a # of physical actions per pip in your Str attribute/Stamina skill, where after you do X number of actions you make a Stamina check of easy. Each additional multiple of that bumps the stamina check up one level (to moderate, then difficult, then very difficult) and so on.

What do you all think of such a rule? what should happen if you fail?
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Confucious sayeth, don't wash cat while drunk!

[DougRed4]

It's not a bad idea. Like I said there, I'd be up for seeing a roll have to be made after one reaches the threshold, then another roll for every action thereafter (until one rests).
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Currently Running: Villains & Vigilantes (a 32-year-old campaign with multiple groups) and D6 Star Wars; mostly on hiatus are Adventures in Middle-earth and Delta Green

[nuclearwookiee]

For ease of reference, I'm just going to refer to the number of actions a character can take before being required to make a Stamina check, regardless of how you might calculate that number, as the "action pool." And I didn't mention it in the other thread, but I am leaning toward making these required Stamina checks "free" in the sense that they don't count against MAPs.

garhkal: When I came up with this idea, I was just thinking the wages of failure would be the same as for any other failed Stamina check: the character becomes fatigued and suffers -1D to all actions until the character rests for as long as he was in combat. Fail three times and you're completely exhausted as on p. 59 of the 2d Ed. R&E.

DougRed4: How much rest did you have in mind to reset the action pool? My thought is that if a fatigued character recovers after resting for a length of time equal to the time spent in exertion, the time to recover an action pool should be less because the character hasn't yet pushed himself to the point of fatigue.

I think I would prefer to make some sort of active Stamina skill check for recovering actions. If a character makes an elective Stamina check in a round (not one required by virtue of completely expending his action pool), he restores a number of actions to his pool equal to his Stamina skill check total divided by 5, rounded up. In other words, a result of 1 to 5 (Very Easy) = 1 restored action, 6 to 10 (Easy) = 2 restored actions, 11 to 15 (Moderate) = 3 restored actions, and so on. But I would make this elective Stamina check an action that counts against the action pool. But because a Very Easy check restores one action, attempting this recovery Stamina check is always at least cost neutral from the action pool perspective, but of course the drawback is that it will still contribute to a character's MAPs. I think this approach would work nicely with DougRed4's idea of calling for increasing Stamina rolls for each action in excess of a character's action pool. In this case, though, I might make the first required Stamina check start at a difficulty higher than Easy. That piece is still up in the air for me.

[DougRed4]

Nicely done, nuclearwookiee!

I think making a character rest for a number of minutes equal to the number of actions taken might be a simple rule of thumb. So if a character took nine actions (STR and DEX) over a short period of time and failed their Stamina check, they'd have to stop and rest for nine minutes until they were fully recovered.

The supers game we play (V&V) has a separate "Power" score that basically tracks one's fuel/bio-energy, and when one runs out they're fatigued. The average person will have about 40 Power, and a super might have a score of 100. When resting, they recover one per minute, so it often takes an hour or more of rest to recuperate, once one is exhausted.

I like the idea of restoring a number of actions to his action pool depending on the quality of the roll, though it's more bookkeeping than I prefer (as I'd want to add another chart to my rules if I incorporated it).
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Currently Running: Villains & Vigilantes (a 32-year-old campaign with multiple groups) and D6 Star Wars; mostly on hiatus are Adventures in Middle-earth and Delta Green

[garhkal]

Being one could easily hit that say 9 action thresh hold in two to three rounds, having one have to wait for 9 minutes is imo a little harsh. 9 rounds i could see, or even one full minute.
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Confucious sayeth, don't wash cat while drunk!

[DougRed4]

It's going to be rare that somebody takes nine actions of a strenuous nature outside of combat.

I guess I was thinking of non-combat situations only, where one was running and jumping and climbing and the like...
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Currently Running: Villains & Vigilantes (a 32-year-old campaign with multiple groups) and D6 Star Wars; mostly on hiatus are Adventures in Middle-earth and Delta Green

[garhkal]

Let's take a look at one of my modules. It has an obstacle course in it.

First up you get a sprint. Being most beings get a 10 move (its rare i see human pcs pushing it), that equates to 40 for an all out sprint. 4 Rolls would equate to a 160 meter dash.
I then have a swim, most moves for non aquatic races are halved, so that would be 20m per round, 6 rolls (rounds) for a total of 120 meter swimming event. Followed by an obstacle course that has: 3 dex checks, 3 climb/jumps, 2 lifts 3 stamina and 2 running checks. All diff is 13. Total each individual group rolls (climb, lift, run etc), and then –10 for each failed stamina check. Who has the highest overall wins. 3/2/1.

The base dex checks are for swinging on ropes, climb are going up walls/cargo nettings, the running rolls are for Balancing on a beam, and the lifting checks are going through a pair of walls you have to lift up and run under (like american ninja warrior).

There i have the stamina rolls as part OF the obstacle course, failing it takes off a set amt from the rolls of the other aspects in the course, but none prior to it in the sprint/swim.
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Confucious sayeth, don't wash cat while drunk!

[Naaman]

Heres how I like to do it:

At a time determined by the GM, (for example, after the first 5 rounds or whatever) All characters make a stamina check. Only the GM should nlknow the result of each check. Each player also knows his own result.

This starts the stamina "clock" with each round of combat counting as one "tick" on the clock. The GM tracks each tick and when the ticks equal/exceed your stamina check, your character starts suffering penalties.

Since a person knows when he's starting to tire, he can look for ways to "take breaks" etc or else avoid taxing himself if ue doesnt want to run out of stamina too quickly.

Im not a fan of rolling "at the last minute" and then findimg out that my character is fatigued because of a botched roll even though he's got 8D in stamina.

Taking a break might be forgoing a turn while hifing behind cover or some such.

[Raven Redstar]

That's not a bad way to do it Naaman, I think I'll start doing it that way as well for long chases & combat.
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RR
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[garhkal]

Perhaps those stamina checks then should be at the beginning of the combat, so they know how long they can go at 'full bore' before they need to rest..
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Confucious sayeth, don't wash cat while drunk!

[Raven Redstar]

Or instead of rounds, you do a number of actions taken. A character doing 5 actions in a round is going to get tired faster than someone doing one, right?
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RR
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[Naaman]

All true what you guys say. I like to give it a few rounds to see if combat is going to last a while. Otherwise, tracking stamina for a two or three round fight adds, in my opinion, unnecessary steps.

[nuclearwookiee]

[atgxtg]

I was thinking that this could be simplified. Probably something like making a stamina roll to avoid fatigue MAPs every Stamina dice in minutes. Half that if you are doing more that your Stamina dice in actions (average) during that time, double it if you are doing half your stamina dice in actions.

[Naaman]

Yes I agree. I was more referring to the ways Ive seen stamina used in actual play. GM decides its time for a stamina check and POOF! you're all of a sudden tired because is the first time in the 20-week campaign youve ever had to male a stamina check and you have no CPs invested in the skill.

I honestly thimk that a roll right off the bat (in conjunction with initiative is the simplest way. Lowest roll tires out first.